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European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

arstechnica.com

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Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#241

Post by [deleted] »

nehal3m wrote: post #231
tmikaeld wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> …Teslas. Or at least it was, until they removed the physical turn signal controls. The turn signals wasn’t removed, they moved them to the steering wheel as physical buttons. Which ofc isn’t optimal, because you turn it…

You’re supposed to signal before you turn the wheel. Way too often I see people signaling as they turn, not because they are trying to communicate with other road users but because it’s the law. Indicate your intent first and then take the indicated action.

[deleted]

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#242

Post by modeless »

tmikaeld wrote: post #217
modeless wrote: post #207

> Now, Euro NCAP is not insisting on everything being its own button or switch. But the organization wants to see physical controls for turn signals, hazard lights, windshield wipers, the horn, and any SOS features This is much more reasonable than I assumed. Unlike seemingly most people here I have no problem whatsoever with fan controls or audio controls or whatever on the touchscreen, as long as it is responsive (…

> …Teslas. Or at least it was, until they removed the physical turn signal controls. The turn signals wasn’t removed, they moved them to the steering wheel as physical buttons. Which ofc isn’t optimal, because you turn it…

I would call them virtual buttons rather than true physical buttons, as they are capacitive touch buttons that don't depress and are missing a defined physical boundary. Granted, they are fixed in place and don't move. Except that, as you point out, they do move...

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#243

Post by gnicholas »

bhpm wrote: post #23
cwillu wrote: post #2

A start, but not far enough: anything a driver might be reasonably expected to do while driving should have a physical control. Zero-force, zero-feedback, zero-travel controls should be illegal for such functions.

Wouldn’t it be safer to require all cars to have voice controls? Then the driver doesn’t have to move their hand off the wheel at all.

I've heard some of the newer cars have pretty good voice controls, especially on the more expensive models. However, the companies tend to put these behind a subscription wall, which I hate. I don't want my car to be always connected to the cloud. I'll do my navigation via my phone, and nothing else requires connectivity (except perhaps if I had an EV and wanted to schedule charging stops).

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#244

Post by gambiting »

martin8412 wrote: post #234
nehal3m wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re supposed to signal before you turn the wheel. Way too often I see people signaling as they turn, not because they are trying to communicate with other road users but because it’s the law. Indicate your intent first and then take the indicated action.

Roundabouts..

Correct. But then maybe OP lives somewhere where roundabouts aren't very common so they never ran into that usecase.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#245

Post by gambiting »

tom_ wrote: post #90
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are there really cars where the horn is not a physical button/ring on the steering wheel? Yes: https://antiquecarmuseumofiowa.org/wp-content/uploads/1913-F... Well ... "are" is kinda stretching it...

My 1995 Renault Clio had it as a button on the indicator stalk. Worked very well, in my view. Much easier than pressing the centre of the steering wheel. There's often no need to even move your hand!

It's a French thing - my Peugeot Partner was the same, horn on the indicator stalk.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#246

Post by DinaCoder99 »

static_void_ wrote: post #89
I_Am_Nous wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>At least the steering wheel and pedals still behave the same. For now, companies are experimenting with drive by wire. Don't think I like that concept.

Electronic power steering already exists. It's used in a lot of cars, and has been for at least 10 years. Your car may have one of these systems in it. In an electric power steering system there are steering angle and torque sensors that know what direction the wheel is turned an how hard it has turned, and this is connected to an electric motor that powers the gears to move the steering rack. There are still regulat…

Being able to feel the resistance of the road is valuable, especially in inclement weather. Much more so than with, say, an airplane.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#247

Post by modeless »

sundvor wrote: post #237
modeless wrote: post #207

> Now, Euro NCAP is not insisting on everything being its own button or switch. But the organization wants to see physical controls for turn signals, hazard lights, windshield wipers, the horn, and any SOS features This is much more reasonable than I assumed. Unlike seemingly most people here I have no problem whatsoever with fan controls or audio controls or whatever on the touchscreen, as long as it is responsive (…

Tesla wiper? Just push the wiper button on the left stalk and you can cycle through the speed settings with the left funky switch (multi function button) in addition to the on screen display options that then pop up. Very easy to do. Also this: https://youtube.com/shorts/3eKcDOHVZWc?si=-jL4o4Bhu-2y0ibj Doesn't cover the left multi function button feature after short pressing the wiper button. (Model 3, 2022, Australi…

> Just push the wiper button on the left stalk and you can cycle through the speed settings with the left funky switch

Yes, they added this relatively recently. For the first few years I owned the car this was not possible. Also, guess what, it still sucks! More steps than a physical control, fiddly because of the short timeout, and still requires an extra step of looking at the touchscreen because you can't know which way to push the wheel without finding out the current setting. Is it on "Auto" or "Off"? They're at opposite ends of the menu. Acceptable for something less important like setting the A/C temperature; definitively not acceptable for something safety critical like wipers.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#248

Post by jojobas »

rkagerer wrote: post #214
userbinator wrote: post #16

But the organization wants to see physical controls for turn signals, hazard lights, windshield wipers, the horn Are there really cars where the horn is not a physical button/ring on the steering wheel? IMHO the driving UX peaked in the 1960s, and was largely unchanged into the 2000s, until touch screens started taking over. Compare: https://i0.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads... https://images-stag.…

At least the steering wheel and pedals still behave the same. Don't give them ideas...

Tesla Cybertruck uses steer-by-wire with almost no redundancy. Electric power steering was bad enough to cause crashes, this is just ambulance chaser's dream.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#249

Post by [deleted] »

infotainment wrote: post #44
izzydata wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything I ever hear about Tesla's keeps getting worse and worse. How are they still in business and why does anyone buy one?

Have you seen the other BEVs available in America? There really isn't much choice if you don't want an SUV -- your options are basically a Tesla or a Chevy Bolt.

[deleted]

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#250

Post by izacus »

noirbot wrote: post #148
culopatin wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Mazda 3 is such a pretty car in and out. I wish there was an AWD turbo manual or a fully electric one. Either one will make me replace the Prius.

I've owned one for so long and it makes me so upset that Mazda doesn't have an EV yet. I just want my current car as an EV and I'd be happy.

Yeah, I was hoping to replace mine with something like a modern 6 PHEV but they went full on SUV these days. A pity, their interior and UX design is still second to none
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