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More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

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Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#21

Post by smugglerFlynn »

TylerE wrote: post #8
user3939382 wrote: post #4

This is to the point where, although it's irrational but I know statistically I'd be fine, I'd be scared to fly on any new generation Boeing.

I'm not sure it's irrational at this point. The entire program seems to have been grossly mismanaged, and that includes on the FAA side.

Let's say 15 year old Toyota arrives on your Uber, instead of a shiny new one - would you cancel and wait for another car? Keep in mind that riding in both cars is statistically vastly more dangerous than flying any modern Boeing, including 737, by a huge margin.

Unless flying is the only mode of transportation you ever use, avoiding Boeing will not make your life safer, it will at most make you calmer.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#22

Post by spamizbad »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #6
rossdavidh wrote: post #3

I do get the impression that the current Boeing CEO is attempting to turn the culture around, to a more "admit the problem and fix it" kind of attitude. The problem is that, if you are doing this after many years of "deny the problem and ship it", the number of apparent problems is actually going to go up for a while. I wonder if Boeing's customers and shareholders will have enough patience for him to complete the tr…

Boeing needs to dump the CEO and install someone from an engineering lineage if they want to build their reputation back. An engineering company run by a longtime manager with a background in accounting is in large part how Boeing got here. Fire the guy and get someone with a technical background in there.

I don't think having an engineer as a leader is some golden ticket to success. Its ultimately what ruined Nortel for example.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#23

Post by wasmitnetzen »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #7
rossdavidh wrote: post #3

I do get the impression that the current Boeing CEO is attempting to turn the culture around, to a more "admit the problem and fix it" kind of attitude. The problem is that, if you are doing this after many years of "deny the problem and ship it", the number of apparent problems is actually going to go up for a while. I wonder if Boeing's customers and shareholders will have enough patience for him to complete the tr…

Boeing’s customers have no choice. There is only one other option in town, and Airbus is at capacity for quite a few more years. The only threat Boeing has is governments fining them. So as long as governments (or the US government) let Boeing continue to function, there should be sufficient time to fix culture.

Shareholders might have an opinion though, and Ryanair buying MAX's at a discount when nobody else wanted them might not make them happy.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#24

Post by Etheryte »

golemotron wrote: post #19

Is there a travel site that allows you to filter out 737Maxes?

This question comes up every time articles like these come up and the answer is no, there is no reliable way unless you check what airplane you're boarding right as you walk on it. Airlines regularly swap out planes to cover up for delayed flights, weather, mismatched demand etc and the plane model you're shown as you're buying the ticket is not necessarily the plane you're gonna fly.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#26

Post by mc32 »

rossdavidh wrote: post #3

I do get the impression that the current Boeing CEO is attempting to turn the culture around, to a more "admit the problem and fix it" kind of attitude. The problem is that, if you are doing this after many years of "deny the problem and ship it", the number of apparent problems is actually going to go up for a while. I wonder if Boeing's customers and shareholders will have enough patience for him to complete the tr…

I’m sorry, but too little, too late. It’s time for a new executive team incl CEO.

They breached the trust of their customers. I want to see new leadership, not someone who suddenly turns a new leaf.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#27

Post by TylerE »

smugglerFlynn wrote: post #21
TylerE wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure it's irrational at this point. The entire program seems to have been grossly mismanaged, and that includes on the FAA side.

Let's say 15 year old Toyota arrives on your Uber, instead of a shiny new one - would you cancel and wait for another car? Keep in mind that riding in both cars is statistically vastly more dangerous than flying any modern Boeing, including 737, by a huge margin. Unless flying is the only mode of transportation you ever use, avoiding Boeing will not make your life safer, it will at most make you calmer.

That's not the choice though. It's choosing one new car that doesn't have a bunch of safety recalls over one that does.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#28

Post by jacquesm »

sebzim4500 wrote: post #20
tsunamifury wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes the fantasy that an IC can just magic this all away. This would likely result in a CEO with no pull and a CFO that had all the hard power to call the shots. The reality seems to be, for some reason, building profitable and safe planes in America is becoming increasingly difficult. A company most be able to do both: build a quality and safe product and make a margin. It can’t exist without revenue. I’m guessing…

>The reality seems to be, for some reason, building profitable and safe planes in America is becoming increasingly difficult. Is there another data point or are you just basing this off Boeing's issues?

The other datapoints have been merged into Boeing or they went away, Lockheed hasn't made a passenger plane for decades.

Gulfstream doesn't really count I think, because it isn't in competition with either Boeing or Airbus.

Re: More misdrilled holes on 737 MAX in latest setback

#29

Post by medstrom »

stouset wrote: post #18
user3939382 wrote: post #4

This is to the point where, although it's irrational but I know statistically I'd be fine, I'd be scared to fly on any new generation Boeing.

It is irrational. Since November 2001, there has been one death aboard a major airline operating in the U.S.[1]. That was a Southwest flight where an entire engine self-destructed. It was an issue with the CFM engine, Not with anything Boeing did. You might choose to include one more. An Asiana flight tumbled end over end after arriving short at SFO. Everyone survived the crash, but a passenger was killed when an eme…

Let's wait for statistics on the new plane :)
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