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ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

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Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#281

Post by Sporktacular »

vladgur wrote: post #144
voisin wrote: post #6

Perhaps I am unlearned in this area but I am unclear why the Jewish state, after its people experienced the atrocities of World War II, would act in this manner toward the Palestinians. Can anyone shed light on this? I understand completely the need to rid the world of Hamas terrorists, but in the process they have shown a reckless disregard (to put it mildly) for Palestinian people and their wellbeing.

I was in my 20s and remember the feeling in the air after Al Qaeda members hijacked commercial planes and flew them into WTC in 2001. Fear, Anger, A bit of revenge. Many of Americans, including soviet immigrants, enlisted in the army driven by that feeling. Israelis lost significantly more of their population percentage-wise during October 7 attack perpetrated by the official government of Gaza AND as we know now, so…

Hamas barely scraped into victory in a power sharing agreement it then broke. Gazan at that time did not want this government. Half of Gaza's present population wasn't even born at the time of the last election. To blame Palestinians generally (including in the West Bank who are effectively being punished too) for this is exceedingly unfair.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/was-hamas-electe...

Compare culpability with Israel's, which IS a functioning democracy, has had regular elections, a free press, a large population participating in the war and actively in favour of it - and blaming the average Gazan is even less fair.

Feeling like revenge isn't good enough.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#282

Post by blitz_skull »

What's the ICJ's actual ability to enforce this? "Orders" sounds like they have some sort of weight to throw around if Israel doesn't comply, but I'm not familiar with the ICJ or what possible consequences could arise if Israel simply decided it was going to do what it wanted.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#284

Post by oatmeal1 »

voisin wrote: post #6

Perhaps I am unlearned in this area but I am unclear why the Jewish state, after its people experienced the atrocities of World War II, would act in this manner toward the Palestinians. Can anyone shed light on this? I understand completely the need to rid the world of Hamas terrorists, but in the process they have shown a reckless disregard (to put it mildly) for Palestinian people and their wellbeing.

The human mind isn't rational. Don't expect just because they very well know what genocide is, that they can't convince themselves they aren't committing genocide.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#285

Post by r2_pilot »

throwaway8877 wrote: post #178
alan-hn wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your claim that Israel does not use an apartheid system of control and discrimination is false https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2022/02/israels-...

[flagged]

Are you a credible entity to make determinations about credibility, throwaway8877?

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#286

Post by GordonS »

xenospn wrote: post #125
aaomidi wrote: post #77

I do think that their future Feb ruling is going to call for a ceasefire. If they called for one now, Israel & especially the US were just going to ignore it and reduce the power of the court. Israel has created a beast that I don't think they can control themselves. I do think that the court is going to get more legitimacy after they explicitly tell Israel to __chill__, for Israel not to chill, and then get the ceas…

I can assure you Israel will most likely ignore any resolution that does not involve the hostages returning.

If they cared about the hostages, they wouldn't be bombing them to death on a daily basis, shooting those that escape, or gassing them in tunnels. The hostages are nothing more than political pawns to Netanyahu.

Keep in mind that Hamas reiterated their ceasefire deal recently, which includes the release of all hostages, and Israel rejected it.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#287

Post by aaomidi »

Aunche wrote: post #245
aaomidi wrote: post #77

I do think that their future Feb ruling is going to call for a ceasefire. If they called for one now, Israel & especially the US were just going to ignore it and reduce the power of the court. Israel has created a beast that I don't think they can control themselves. I do think that the court is going to get more legitimacy after they explicitly tell Israel to __chill__, for Israel not to chill, and then get the ceas…

> I am so deeply disappointed in the Biden administration here. What do you expect him to do? With or without any assistance, Israel has more than enough weapons completely annihilate Gaza. Don't forget that they likely have nuclear capabilities. Israel believes they are demonstrating restraint and this restraint is the first thing to go if Israel feels like it's being backed into a corner.

Things like this are bad: https://apnews.com/article/us-israel-gaza-arms-hamas-bypass-...

More public denouncement of what Israel is doing.

Get the Department of State to start sanctioning heads of state of Israel that are actively calling for a genocide.

He's effectively done nothing other than "handling it in private."

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#288

Post by SomeoneFromCA »

surume wrote: post #263

Hi All, I am a combat soldier and commander in the IDF currently fighting in Gaza. We are not committing any genocide. The give away for Genocide is that there are mass graves, which in Gaza there are not. Yes there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields, so we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them. We risk ourselves and our soldiers to ensure that the…

[flagged]

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#289

Post by aaomidi »

mantas wrote: post #274
threeseed wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Because they are a terrorist organisation. Israel is expected to because they are not.

Hamas is democratically elected government in Gaza.

Really? Democratically elected? Elections in Gaza, over a decade ago, are the bar for democracy now?

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#290

Post by nashashmi »

surume wrote: post #263

Hi All, I am a combat soldier and commander in the IDF currently fighting in Gaza. We are not committing any genocide. The give away for Genocide is that there are mass graves, which in Gaza there are not. Yes there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields, so we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them. We risk ourselves and our soldiers to ensure that the…

> there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields

When you say things like this, I know that you are either spreading IDF propaganda or have been wired to believe IDF propaganda. Either way it is telling what soldiers are experiencing.

None of the things you stated are any different than what IDF associated press has stated. This makes your post incredibly suspect.

As this is HN, and we welcome on-the-ground views, we are not finding too much info about what is actually happening from the ground view in your post.

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