Live data from Hacker News

Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

bsky.app

91–100 of 129 posts

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, then I set the date on my computer to year the 2124. Now the DRM is unlocked! You can't build a "time lock" with just encryption primitives. Even if you could build a time lock with just encryption primitives, we don't know when the copyright will expire until the original author has died, since copyright term is life + 70 years. Someone would have to run a server that specifically chooses to start serving the…

Not at all absurd. Maybe not through crypto but otherwise perfectly achievable. No reason to achieve this within a file. If you really want to, some fancy solution involving blockchains and smart contracts is probably possible but there is no need. Require by law all who desire copyright protection to register the work with a governmental agency and place a copy of the work in escrow at an archive as a condition. The…

>> If the federal government were interested in passing a law that required this, I'm sure the Library of Congress could run such a server, but no such law exists.

> Require by law all who desire copyright protection to register the work with a governmental agency and place a copy of the work in escrow at an archive as a condition.

You’re just repeating what I already wrote. By all means, call your representatives.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#92

Is there something where a projector needs to be connected to the internet? This seems as silly as bluetooth speakers like Sonos needing an internet connection. Perhaps someone can share what is needed here and why it's connected.

Sonos isn’t Bluetooth speakers, they have a couple in their portable lineup that do offer Bluetooth, but last I checked the majority don’t offer Bluetooth and to be honest I like it better this way.

Not having my phone locked up to only play music is awesome, being able to use voice control to play specific songs and have them play throughout the house is awesome. Bluetooth is a pain, not being able to use Instagram (or any other app that wants control of audio) while my daughter listens to a song sucks.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#93
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, is that better? Leaving all the devices set to EOL and get bricked or whatever feels pretty wasteful.

The studios set the requirements. A certificate that never expires would never fly with their need to control DRM as tightly as possible. If Sony was still in the business, they would offer a certificate renewal for a small fee like the other manufacturers have done. The root problem is that Sony exited the market and left a lot of cinema owners out to dry with the looming cost of $50,000+ per auditorium for replacem…

Any idea if these projectors could be made to work with other sources that don't require DRM? As much as this sucks for movie theaters, it could also be the deal of the century for a home theater build if you know the right people...

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#94

I wonder how much longer until we have a military or medical device that doesn't work killing people because a DRM certificate expired...

Ohh this has already started. Happened to me the other day: machine for rectal air insufflation under x-ray guidance to allow reduction of an intussusception (a condition where the bowel folds in on itself). It primarily affects young children and if the procedure fails they require an open operation. Failure to treat the intussusception eventually results in bowel perforation, peritonitis and potentially death. Went…

It was (and probably still is) quite common to hire a cracker to remove the DRM from industrial equipment software to prevent any downtime it causes; of course that's not a life-support application, and the motive was that downtime for such machinery is often very costly.

Of course with the recent Polish train debacle (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38788360) stories of DRM schemes where incomplete defeat causes subtly worse behaviour (rather common in games), and the ability to engineer a system with plausible deniability in mind, like some of Apple's hardware-locking attempts, one does wonder whether medical devices may have such logic bombs too.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#95
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 and 2 - this seems incompatible with how 90% of the population uses software, namely they set it and forget it. Having to manually approve and schedule every single update for everything a user touches would be a) a security nightmare, as most things would never get updated ever and b) a UX nightmare, with a million different things asking for updates. 3 - Maintaining a data path forward is tricky enough. Demanding…

It's all an incentive for "don't just churn software, plan well ahead". This also seems to be broadly incompatible with fixing certain security vulnerabilities - would everybody have to maintain TLS 1.1 or plaintext api endpoints for old clients? Or they would forced to produce an update that doesn't do anything other than e.g. upgrade the TLS version --- and has absolutely nothing else.

it also skyrockets the barrier to entry for software to a point that no one but the big companies could compete.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#96

Lots more info here on the Y2K24 bug - http://www.film-tech.com/vbb/forum/main-forum Expired cert. Some players refuse, some ignore it. Affected - Sony (XCT-M10) / GDC SR-1000 - "15-08-2011 18:10:59 UTC 31-12-2023 00:00:00 UTC (expired)" There was a known Y2K24 bug that needed software updates to fix around certs, unsure how/if related - http://www.film-tech.com/vbb/forum/main-forum/26517-dolby-do...

Nice! So that was identified a year ago and it's people who haven't updated since who hit it?

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#97
post #85
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you also think it's fine to shit in other people's wells or for companies to dump their toxic waste in the middle of other companies parking lots as long as you/they haven't signed a contract explicitly agreeing not to? You are using loaded words to 1) imply I would support some questionable actions where you assume intent and 2) refer to negative externalities, but I'll suppose you are not trolling interact in…

>but it's not my liability: you should secure your property, or said differently "your problems aren't my problem" But we're talking about you deliberately not securing or even actively reducing the security of your property in a manner that could reasonably be predicted to lead to harm to other's property, and that harm occuring, through no fault of the harmed party. You're not supposed to store loaded guns unsecure…

> But we're talking about you deliberately not securing or even actively reducing the security of your property

We have different preferences about what's the right security/freedom ratio.

> You're not supposed to store loaded guns unsecured on your front porch (not around here anyways).

I don't think the government or anyone has any say about where or how I may keep my guns.

People believe they might have a say, so there are laws on the books, but they're frequently taken down by the courts.

> So how about the middle ground: Do you believe that the EPA should impose restrictions on companies' or citizens' right to dump whatever toxic waste they want into rivers?

I believe it shouldn't, but that's just my opinion.

You may not believe it, but in terms of efficiency and keeping the environment, it doesn't matter (see below)

> If you think the physical commons should be protected from predictable harm by negligence or reckless disregard, why not the digital?

I don't believe in in the physical word, and I don't believe it in the digital world either.

Regardless of my beliefs, there's a nobel prize winner who's shown that it doesn't matter how the rights are initially assigned, as long as parties can negotiate with no transaction costs.

Check the Coase theorem.

The EPA imposing restrictions create transaction costs, so I think we're better off without them

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#98

Lots more info here on the Y2K24 bug - http://www.film-tech.com/vbb/forum/main-forum Expired cert. Some players refuse, some ignore it. Affected - Sony (XCT-M10) / GDC SR-1000 - "15-08-2011 18:10:59 UTC 31-12-2023 00:00:00 UTC (expired)" There was a known Y2K24 bug that needed software updates to fix around certs, unsure how/if related - http://www.film-tech.com/vbb/forum/main-forum/26517-dolby-do...

I love that the forum where that discussion is taking place doesn't even use HTTPS.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The studios set the requirements. A certificate that never expires would never fly with their need to control DRM as tightly as possible. If Sony was still in the business, they would offer a certificate renewal for a small fee like the other manufacturers have done. The root problem is that Sony exited the market and left a lot of cinema owners out to dry with the looming cost of $50,000+ per auditorium for replacem…

IMHO a certificate that expires at the same time as the copyright on a film, and DRM that then "fails open", makes the most sense.

There hasn't been cryptographic algorithms nor a DRM that proved good for > 50 years, let alone 70 years + safety margin. Even 3650 days expiry is considered too long.
Post reply on HN