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Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

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Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#61

Post by thfuran »

csdvrx wrote: post #37
vlovich123 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of those suggestions are things that sound good at first glance but are simply not great ideas. For example, support for downgrades means you a security vulnerability can be reintroduced by a malicious user which may not be desirable. Writing software that’s backwards and forwards compatible across all releases can be extremely expensive to impossible (eg a feature in your application that requires a new OS or y…

> Some of those suggestions are things that sound good at first glance but are simply not great ideas. Actually, yes they are. I'm not a big fan of legislation, but the upgrade crazyness has to stop at some point! > For example, support for downgrades means you a security vulnerability can be reintroduced by a malicious user which may not be desirable What if "I, the user" deem it "desirable"? I'm holding to bios wit…

Do you believe that the operator of a deliberately insecure system should be liable if it ends up suborned by a botnet and used to attack someone else's system?

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#62

Post by MobiusHorizons »

hypeatei wrote: post #29
handoflixue wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a society, we've already concluded that contracts are insufficient to cover a huge class of situations (minimum wages, banning non-competes, etc.). Why would you think they're sufficient to handle this one? We already have simple systems that handle "you broke my stuff" fairly well - why would we want to lean on something as slow and complex as antitrust laws to resolve this? The Epic vs Google lawsuit started in…

> Why would you think they're sufficient to handle this one? It's a business transaction where contracts are the norm. Sony may not be very flexible on terms, but no one is forced to buy their projectors and agree to the terms. > why would we want to lean on something as slow and complex as antitrust laws We would if consumers had no other choice but to buy Sony projectors only - that doesn't seem to be the case, tho…

> but no one is forced to buy their projectors and agree to the terms

I don’t know how much choice movie theaters have. As I understand it, these projectors read directly from a hard drive, and are heavily regulated to avoid piracy. According to the Wikipedia article [1] there are only 4 approved manufacturers, and until very recently Sony had the only 4k model.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_cinema (see the projectors for digits cinema section)

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#64

Post by Aloha »

dn3500 wrote: post #56
sprocket35 wrote: post #41

Digital cinema tech here. Sony hasn’t been releasing updates since they exited the business in 2020. This is likely an expired certificate related to the encryption on the movie files.

A digital cinema tech with the username "sprocket35"?

I mean his comment history is on par with who he says he is - I think it's a great name. Just because I work mostly in the digital domain doesn't mean I dont long for the analog.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#65

Post by csdvrx »

thfuran wrote: post #61
csdvrx wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some of those suggestions are things that sound good at first glance but are simply not great ideas. Actually, yes they are. I'm not a big fan of legislation, but the upgrade crazyness has to stop at some point! > For example, support for downgrades means you a security vulnerability can be reintroduced by a malicious user which may not be desirable What if "I, the user" deem it "desirable"? I'm holding to bios wit…

Do you believe that the operator of a deliberately insecure system should be liable if it ends up suborned by a botnet and used to attack someone else's system?

> Do you believe that the operator of a deliberately insecure system should be liable

Only if said operator signed a contract. No contract=no liability.

Here in the US, the Supreme Court has made it clear that law enforcement agencies are not required to provide protection to the citizens cf https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-po...

If even the police isn't liable, why should I be liable or have any kind of duty to protect your system?

Your system, your problem.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#66

Post by thfuran »

csdvrx wrote: post #65
thfuran wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you believe that the operator of a deliberately insecure system should be liable if it ends up suborned by a botnet and used to attack someone else's system?

> Do you believe that the operator of a deliberately insecure system should be liable Only if said operator signed a contract. No contract=no liability. Here in the US, the Supreme Court has made it clear that law enforcement agencies are not required to provide protection to the citizens cf https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-po... If even the police isn't liable, why should I be liable or have…

Do you also think it's fine to shit in other people's wells or for companies to dump their toxic waste in the middle of other companies parking lots as long as you/they haven't signed a contract explicitly agreeing not to?

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#67

Post by FirmwareBurner »

userbinator wrote: post #53
crazygringo wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are certificates usually/often issued to expire at the end of a given calendar year? On the one hand, that would explain this happening on Dec 31. But it's slightly weird because it's not yet the new year in UTC. This was posted several hours before that happening, and we've still got over 2 hours to go... (And the cinema is in New York, with almost 8 hours to go in local time, so it's not a local timezone issue eith…

This is Sony, and it is the new year in Japan.

Sony is a Japanese company but it's also a multinational company consisting of hundreds of companies they aquired over the years all over the globe. It's therefore a relatively small chance is has something to do with Japan specifically.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#68

Post by dejj »

amelius wrote: post #6
crazygringo wrote: post #2

Super curious if there's any kind of contractual recourse where theaters can recoup the lost income from Sony. It's one thing if a projector breaks mechanically or due to a pre-existing bug; it's another thing when an update breaks it. In an age where updates are increasingly the norm, I wonder if there's legislation needed to hold manufacturers accountable for updates that break otherwise perfectly-functioning hardw…

> In an age where updates are increasingly the norm, I wonder if there's legislation needed to hold manufacturers accountable for updates that break otherwise perfectly-functioning hardware? Maybe there should be a law that says: 1. Upgrades may be performed but never behind the user's back. 2. In particular, the user determines exactly when an upgrade is performed. 3. The user may roll back any update at any time. 4…

Amelius’ 5 laws to Asimov’s 3.

Make them a bit terser, and maybe “Right to repair” will heave them out of the science fiction tarpit.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#69

Post by guhidalg »

ipython wrote: post #24
guhidalg wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sure Sony is sensitive to the PR hit from movie theaters telling their customers that the reason they can’t watch a movie is precisely due to a Sony software update. Next time the consumer is buying a Sony product they’ll think twice about its software reliability.

I argue Sony doesn’t care as this isn’t the first time they’ve shafted customers (see below), and it sure as heck won’t be the last. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_roo...

Thanks for sharing that, my trust is Sony’s software is now lower than before.

Re: Sony software updates breaks movie theater projectors

#70

Post by swells34 »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #67
userbinator wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is Sony, and it is the new year in Japan.

Sony is a Japanese company but it's also a multinational company consisting of hundreds of companies they aquired over the years all over the globe. It's therefore a relatively small chance is has something to do with Japan specifically.

It likely depends on where the programmer who has the original cert issued was... so quite likely Japan, given the evidence
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