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Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

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Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#171

Post by avgcorrection »

contrarian1234 wrote: post #106
kristofferR wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's nothing, whole genders have striked before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1975_Icelandic_women%27s_strik...

A bit apples to oranges. That's an actual strike. They don't go in to work and they don't get paid. They didn't selectively continue working but only for X that they decided are they good guys

I don’t understand why anyone should care about whatever an “actual strike” is. Maybe some labor organization strikes against working with some hazardous product like asbestos. So they refuse to work with it. But they continue to work with other materials. Because they’re not striking against all the other products that they work with...

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#172

Post by eddtries »

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #145
kristofferR wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that proper unions are pretty baffling from a US perspective, where people don't mind having thousands peeing in bottles at work at Amazon as long as they get the spoon they ordered the next day. Us Scandinavians on the other hand find it pretty baffling that someone would just roll over to a megalomaniac who clearly states he would like to destroy what makes our countries great, our unions and working conditio…

I think you do not understand the basic fact that the people peeing in bottles are not working there against their will. As bad as it may be or sound, people choose to voluntarily work there. But sure, go fight your fight with the megalomaniac...

People don't really choose to work, we work because we need to afford food and get health care and rent housing etc. If you live in a town where the job you can get is at Amazon then you don't really "voluntarily" work there, and considering it's pretty simple stuff that hires anyone this is probably the case.

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#173

Post by waihtis »

derelicta wrote: post #103
waihtis wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU economy is doing so great, we can surely afford to introduce even more bureaucracy around doing business - perhaps even a new, separate committee that all business has to go through!

You are right. Those businesses should simply be managed by the workers themselves. This way we wouldn't need parallel structures and we would still get proper representation for whose who create wealth themselves.

Perhaps (and hopefully) you're being sarcastic with that marxist lingo, but thinking the entire wealth resides in employees is like thinking a set of wheels is equivalent to a car. Integral, but useless without the organized framework around it.

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#174

Post by andsoitis »

archagon wrote: post #163
ExoticPearTree wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it funny that you think he should not be able to do whatever he wants with his companies. He bought Twitter and it was his prerogative to direct everyone there to tell him why he's not number one on that platform. He did not buy Twitter to make money.

Where exactly did the poster say he should not be able to do so? It’s just vain.

> Where exactly did the poster say he should not be able to do so?

It is implied with the phrase “burns company hours”

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#175

Post by smcl »

contrarian1234 wrote: post #73
sorenjan wrote: post #13

This and the Danish solidarity actions are mainly to prevent Tesla from shipping cars meant for the Swedish market to Danish or Norwegian ports and then trucking them to Sweden. The Swedish transport union stopped unloading Tesla cars at Swedish ports November 7, but Tesla Y was still one of the most sold car models in Sweden in November (second place between Volvo XC40 and XC60).

That doesn't sound like a strike at all. They presumably are still working and getting paid their wages Legally that seems a bit crazy that shipping company workers can select what gets shipped based on their political beliefs. Next the power utility company workers are going to refuse to give Tesla electricity

You're talking like they're acting out based on some unrelated or irrelevant thing - as if they're taking a stand against Elon Musk's stance on trans people or his rather unique ideas about what "free speech" is. The unions are acting against Tesla out of their own self-interest - Tesla do not want to collectively bargain with a union. This is not something these unions are OK with and allowing it to continue unopposed could set a precedent that threatens their members and the conditions they've fought for.

In a sense these unions do have a lot of power when all of their interests align. But because of the sheer number of people and diversity of their industries and the political capital they expend in performing these actions, they don't tend to act at this scale very often. You need to have fucked up pretty badly to have mobilised all of these people against you.

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#176

Post by archagon »

andsoitis wrote: post #174
archagon wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where exactly did the poster say he should not be able to do so? It’s just vain.

> Where exactly did the poster say he should not be able to do so? It is implied with the phrase “burns company hours”

All I see is the implication that it’s a giant waste of everyone’s time.

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#177

Post by edgyquant »

stiray wrote: post #127

I think that whole thing is just a huge misunderstanding of elmu thinking that whole world works like USA. And even in USA, union members in average earn 18% more than others. On the other side, strike and unionizing is one of basic workers rights here and you just don't fight unions in EU. As you will be losing more money than if you get to an agreement with them. When elmu started his crusade against unions, I was…

Are you referring to Elon as Elmo? Is this some new cringe term on Reddit ive yet to hear?

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#178

Post by andsoitis »

archagon wrote: post #166
andsoitis wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're trying to find a rational reason for impulsive behavior. There is no "why". He thought the anti-semitic meme was funny/right without thinking too much about it. If you cared to watch the the interview I linked to above with Andrew Ross Sorkin at the NYT Dealbook summmit, you will hear three things: a) remorse for the dumb thing he said (he says it is probably the worst mistake he has made) b) when you say a…

Beyond what law?

> Beyond what law?

X operates worldwide and even though Elon Musk is a staunch believer in free speech, X also has to follow laws of different jurisdictions, including limitations on speech.

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#179

Post by verzali »

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #155
holgerschurig wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, then you completely misunderstanding things. It's not about joining, not at all. Actually what they ask for changes things for all employees of an industry (e.g. cars, or generally metal), not just for unionized workers. So let me explain on this, as european union culture is VERY different from US union culture. In Europe a lot of countries have a system of "Tarifvertrag" ("tarrif contract", but really "collec…

> The effect of this is visible, e.g. when you look at efficiency of e.g. german workers compared to their US counterparts. Can you please then explain to me how ~ 332mm people in the US are more productive than ~448mm people in the EU by almost 5 trillion dollars if the Americans are less efficient?

It's because Europe has a higher proportion of retired people, and European workers get more holidays, better pensions and better unemployment benefits. When you work out the productivity per hour worked, Europe comes out ahead: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2023/10/04/producti...

Re: Norway Joins Denmark in Swedish Tesla Strike/Blockade

#180

Post by capableweb »

ExoticPearTree wrote: post #155
holgerschurig wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, then you completely misunderstanding things. It's not about joining, not at all. Actually what they ask for changes things for all employees of an industry (e.g. cars, or generally metal), not just for unionized workers. So let me explain on this, as european union culture is VERY different from US union culture. In Europe a lot of countries have a system of "Tarifvertrag" ("tarrif contract", but really "collec…

> The effect of this is visible, e.g. when you look at efficiency of e.g. german workers compared to their US counterparts. Can you please then explain to me how ~ 332mm people in the US are more productive than ~448mm people in the EU by almost 5 trillion dollars if the Americans are less efficient?

What exactly you measure when you measure "amount of people X by almost X trillion dollars"? How did you manage to arrive at a number that supposedly means productivity of individual employees?
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