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Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

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Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#751

Post by jstummbillig »

bmitc wrote: post #592

Through all of this, no one has cogently explained why Altman leaving is such a big deal. Why would workers immediately quit their job when he has no other company, and does he even know who these workers are? Are these people that desperate to make a buck (or the prospect of big bucks)? It seems like half of the people working at the non-profit were not actually concerned about the mission but rather just waiting ou…

I am so confused by how this question is asked, and the reactions.

It's "such a big deal" because he has been leading the company, and apparently some people really like how and they really don't like how it ended.

Why would it require any other explanation? Are you asking what leaders do and why an employee would care about what they do...?

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#752

Post by mcv »

Kwpolska wrote: post #451
loveparade wrote: post #290

For a change, maybe it'd be a good idea to get a CEO who at least has faint idea about how ML works on a technical level? Would you like a company that builds rockets to be led by some salesman who doesn't understand basic Physics? Probably not. You don't need to be Hinton or Schmidhuber, but come on, who thinks it's a good idea to have these typical "Silicon Valley VC CEOs" lead an AI company?

The CEO is so far removed from day-to-day operations that there's no benefit in them having an idea about the technical nitty gritty.

That varies wildly per company. And whether or not that's a good idea also varies. But if company exists specifically to develop a single specific technology, I think the CEO should know a thing or two about that technology. Especially when it's something so easily misunderstand as AI.

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#753

Post by idontwantthis »

LordDragonfang wrote: post #647
idontwantthis wrote: post #554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But my point is what is it actually doing to reach out and touch someone in the doomsday scenario?

I mean, the cliched answer is "when it figures out how to override the nuclear launch process". And while that cliche might have a certain degree of unrealism, it would certainly be possible for a system with access to arbitrary compute power that's specifically trained to impersonate human personas to use social engineering to precipitate WW3. And even that isn't the easiest scenario if an AI just wants us dead; a s…

How can it call one of those labs and place an order for the apocalypse and I can’t right now?

Also about the smart home devices: if a current iPhone can’t run Siri locally then how is a Roomba supposed to run an AGI?

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#754

Post by grey-area »

idontwantthis wrote: post #457
dragonwriter wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Certainly no one is suggesting these systems can become "alive", Lots of people have been publicly suggesting that, and that, if not properly aligned, it poses an existential risk to human civilization; that group includes pretty much the entire founding team of OpenAI, including Altman. The perception of that risk as the downside, as well as the perception that on the other side there is the promise of almost unli…

How does it actually kill a person? When does it stop existing in boxes that require a continuous source of electricity and can’t survive water or fire?

The network is the computer.

If you live in a city right now there are millions of networked computers that humans depend on in their everyday life and do not want to turn off. Many of those computers keep humans alive (grid control, traffic control, comms, hospitals etc). Some are actual robotic killing machines but most have other purposes. Hardly any are air-gapped nowadays and all our security assumes the network nodes have no agency.

A super intelligence residing in that network would be very difficult to kill and could very easily kill lots of people (destroy a dam for example), however that sort of crude threat is unlikely to be a problem. There are lots of potentially bad scenarios though many of them involving the wrong sort of dictator getting control of such an intelligence. There are legitimate concerns here IMO.

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#755

Post by alsodumb »

bmitc wrote: post #730
MattGaiser wrote: post #645

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why would workers immediately quit their job when he has no other company It is Sam Altman. He will have one in a week. > It seems like half of the people working at the non-profit were not actually concerned about the mission but rather just waiting out their turn for big bucks and fame. I would imagine most employees at any organization are not really there because of corporate values, but their own interests. >…

>> Why would workers immediately quit their job when he has no other company > It is Sam Altman. He will have one in a week. His previous companies were Loopt and Worldcoin. Won't his next venture require finding someone else to piggyback off of? > If you are interested in the money side, that isn't something to take lightly. I am interested in how taking billions from foreign companies and states could lead to natio…

His previous ventures don't matter. If he seeks funding, whether millions or billions, he will get it. Period. I don't know how people can reasonably argue that he will have a hard time raising money for a new AI startup along with Greg.

It's not a new board, but it's the time when the board decided to assert their power and make their statement/vision clear.

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#756

Post by krystianantoni »

hobofan wrote: post #641
bmitc wrote: post #592

Through all of this, no one has cogently explained why Altman leaving is such a big deal. Why would workers immediately quit their job when he has no other company, and does he even know who these workers are? Are these people that desperate to make a buck (or the prospect of big bucks)? It seems like half of the people working at the non-profit were not actually concerned about the mission but rather just waiting ou…

He is the one of two original founders :)

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#757

Post by bmitc »

belugacat wrote: post #715
bmitc wrote: post #709

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So it's a big deal because he has a cult of personality?

It’s a big deal because he’s extremely charismatic and well connected and that matters much, much more for a tech company’s success than some programmers like to think.

I have watched him speak, and he doesn't seem charismatic at all. I remember hearing the same things about Sam Bankman-Fried and then going and watching his interviews and feeling the same.

There is just a giant gap here where I simply do not get it, and I see no evidence that explains me not getting it is missing some key aspect of all this. This just seems like classic cargo cult, cult of personality, and following money and people who think they know best

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#758

Post by xiphias2 »

ah765 wrote: post #583
systemvoltage wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is one thing that sticks out: Why didn't the board explain itself clearly? There are times when saying anything publicly would be considered defamation and openining themselves to lawsuits, but it seems that they owe it to their own staff in plain words. They didn't explain the situation properly as per leaked internal announcements.

I think it's possible that Sam had some secret plans involving deals with external companies, that the board learned about. They can't reveal that information without potentially damaging other businesses and becoming liable.

While Sam tried to make the impression that he doesn't know why he was fired, he didn't even try to deny the allegations that he was in talks with the Saudis to create a for profit AI hardware company.

I think you are right that Ilya didn't want to give out secret information to not open up himself to lawsuits.

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#759

Post by fredoliveira »

exitb wrote: post #696
fevangelou wrote: post #674

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% spot on. The world is filled with Sam Altmans, but surely not enough Ilya Sutskevers.

Was Sutskever really that instrumental to OpenAI's success, if it was at all possible for him to be surprised at the direction the company is taking. It doesn't seem that he is that involved in the day-to-day operations.

Anyone asking this question has never gone through Ilya's achievements. He is quite brilliant, and clearly instrumental here. And Sam is amazing in his own way too, for sure.

Re: Emmett Shear becomes interim OpenAI CEO as Altman talks break down

#760

Post by xvector »

BoorishBears wrote: post #687
reissbaker wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The board fired Altman for shipping too fast compared to their safety-ist doom preferences. The new interim CEO has said that he wants to slow AI development down 80-90%. Why on earth would you stay, if you joined to build + ship technology? Of course, some employees may agree with the doom/safety board ideology, and will no doubt stay. But I highly doubt everyone will, especially the researchers who were working on…

Not enough people understand what OpenAI was actually built on. OpenAI would not exist if FAANG had been capable of getting out of it's own way and shipping things. The moment OpenAI starts acting like the companies these people left, it's a no brainer that they'll start looking for the door. I'm sure Ilya has 10 lifetimes more knowledge than me locked away in his mind on topics I don't even know exist... but the las…

I really hope this comes back around and bites Ilya and OAI in the ass. What an absurd decision. They will rightfully get absolutely crushed by the free market.
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