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Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

jenson.org

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Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#661

Post by MayeulC »

julianz wrote: post #484
satvikpendem wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hold down the space bar and you can move the cursor wherever you want, also on Android. I'm surprised more people don't know about this feature.

Holding down the space bar on my (Google) keyboard brings up a popup to change the keyboard. Sliding my finger along the space bar shifts the cursor. I miss my very first Android phone (the original HTC Desire) which had a tiny hole they called an "optical trackball" that worked incredibly well for selecting text.

Ah, that makes me think of the PlayStation Vita and its back-side touchpad. This could be a nice addition to smartphones. The only (substantial!) challenge is to make it usable while holding it.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#662

Post by mackrevinack »

cloudking wrote: post #205
scottjenson wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You actually can paste between words but it's hidden (like most things with mobile text editing) You need to place the text cursor between the words carefully, tap the 'teardrop' on the text handle, and that will bring up the menu to paste. (not saying that's good!)

Wow.. TIL you can tap the tear drop, thanks!

all these years ive been typing in a letter A where i want to paste something, then double tapping the A to highlight it and then selecting paste :/

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#663

Post by vel0city »

sznio wrote: post #648
devilbunny wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a near-perfect solution on Android for years: Swype. Why the people that bought it buried it, I can never understand. It was so much better - even ten years ago - than modern swiping keyboards. It even had a layout that was just for editing.

swype was so damn good and nothing comes even close. too bad it got killed off. windows phone keyboard was good too. the key "hitbox" would grow or shrink based on predictive text and typing speed, so if you're writing something from the dictionary you could just slap the rough area of the button and it would register the most likely one. You'd feel it though when typing in something from outside the dictionary, sudd…

On Gboard you can slide on the spacebar to move the cursor.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#664

Post by mackrevinack »

usrusr wrote: post #555
deely3 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about IPhone but on Android its simply impossible to Paste text between two words. You can't paste text into cursor position you can only replace selected text with Pasted text. Thats my main biggest issue. Also, why the fuck there no Copy/Paste buttons on mobile keyboard??

I eventually learned to place the cursor, squiggle a little random swipe (and a blank) that I can then select and replace. It's certainly an unintuitive nuisance, but my personal biggest issue is something else: No advanced keyboard seems to have a setting to not force an automatic blank after each and every swiped word, no advanced keyboard beyond the original Swype that was abandoned a long time ago. Some have elab…

have you tried florisboard? i would probably use that as my main keyboard but the way it doesn't add a space after words when you swipe something kind of bugs me, especially after getting so used to it with other keyboards

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#665

Post by MayeulC »

deely3 wrote: post #69
fisian wrote: post #8

My biggest problem in editing on mobile is changing a text selection (for example a long URL or long text paragraphs) that don't fit on screen at once. Once I have to scroll (vertically or, even worse, horizontally) in addition to moving the selection handles the UX is just terrible.

I don't know about IPhone but on Android its simply impossible to Paste text between two words. You can't paste text into cursor position you can only replace selected text with Pasted text. Thats my main biggest issue. Also, why the fuck there no Copy/Paste buttons on mobile keyboard??

I really like the additional controls AnySoftKeyboard[1] brings: I like to configure it so that it always displays a left/right arrow above the keyboard to move the cursor. And if you "lift" (gesture up) the space key, there is an additional copy/paste (with clipboard manager)/arrows/selection/undo/redo/etc menu, which is quite useful[2].

Unfortunately I stopped using it in favor of OpenBoard[3] due to subpar autocorrect, especially when typing in French[4].

[1]: https://f-droid.org/en/packages/com.menny.android.anysoftkey...

[2]: screenshot from f-droid: https://f-droid.org/repo/com.menny.android.anysoftkeyboard/e...

[3]: https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.dslul.openboard.inputmet...

[4]: https://github.com/AnySoftKeyboard/AnySoftKeyboard/issues/10...

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#666

Post by vel0city »

hilbert42 wrote: post #574
jillesvangurp wrote: post #458

People produce less text with more errors in more time on mobile. I actively avoid having to type anything on mobile. If I have my laptop open, I'll use whatsapp or signal on that. I often wait replying on either of those until I get my laptop. Just way less frustrating to not have to correct >25% of my key presses. If I have to use the mobile keyboard, I'll often just send a message with typos, no capitals, and skip…

"People produce less text with more errors in more time on mobile." I absolutely agree, typing or editing text on a smartphone is just horrible. There are many times I've started to write an email or post to say HN and I've been so frustrated I've aborted the process and restarted it on my laptop. It's down outright infuriating I have to do this. [I just hope someone of influence at Google reads these posts and acts…

Logitech makes a few good Bluetooth keyboards that are relatively compact. The K480 even has a lip to use like a stand. These are often multi-device so you can pair with a desktop and a phone and quickly change between them. I use the MX Mechanical Mini as my main keyboard these days and switch between my laptop, my desktop, and my phone. Were you thinking of something smaller than these options? Or just lamenting it's mostly just Logitech making decent products in this space?

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/products/keyboards/k480-multi...

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/products/keyboards/k380-mac-m...

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/products/keyboards/mx-mechani...

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#667

Post by pawelmurias »

dTal wrote: post #159
crazygringo wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Smartphones are just for when you're literally unable to use a real computer. Which is literally extremely frequent, since we often need to do stuff on the go. Which is why an article like this is so important -- we should improve, not give up. There's no reason to think text editing on a phone has reached its final form.

You can buy quad core x86 "laptops" - real computers - the size of a phone. How much more "on the go" do you need?

I have big hand so tiny keyboard on a teeny-weeny keyboard won't be usable at all. Desktop Linux is super shit

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#668

Post by MayeulC »

mgdlbp wrote: post #497
jchw wrote: post #349

The vast difference in editing things on a MicroPC with its touchpad and physical keyboard versus a phone is immense . I'm pretty sure I can legitimately type faster and usually navigate UIs faster on a capacitive touch phone, but the frustration of typing and targeting the cursor is unbelievable even after having used smartphones for over a decade now. It's just bad. It is amusing that it's hard to convince people t…

Every time I pick up my pinephone I feel immense disappointment in what forms of interaction most devices are stuck with today, despite how easily alternatives can be implemented in an open platform as the pinephone has shown. But for just editing text, I find vim and emacs surprisingly usable with a touch keyboard, as long as numbers and needed symbols and modifiers are on the base layer. Precise pointing / fat fing…

Ah, I've tried to make my Steam Deck+sway setup usable when undocked, but there are bugs everywhere, from wvkbd mishandling seats or straight up drawing an invisible user interface, to sway not detecting gestures (lisgd seems to work well, though). There are plenty of physical buttons on that platform, but it seems the default kernel driver does not handle them (need to have Steam running, which then sends input through... X11).

It doesn't help that the interfaces for emulating and intercepting input are very rough or experimental (well, there's libei but wlroots doesn't support it). Maybe I should work on a libinput wrapper or my own "parent" compositor?

Anyway, all touchscreens should be able to sense 3D coordinates, which could be used to move a cursor around the screen while hovering. This could be very usable, especially the cursor is shown above the finger position so it isn't hidden. This alone would help a lot with the issues pointed out in the article.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#669

Post by jasonjmcghee »

Woshiwuja wrote: post #554
lolinder wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find that typing on a phone (iPhone or Android) these days is substantially easier than typing on an iPad because of swipe. It's still nowhere as efficient as a keyboard in the hands of a skilled typist, but I can often produce text fast enough that it isn't worth getting out my laptop. On an iPad it's far worse, because I actually do have to use the bad QWERTY touchscreen key-by-key. What I keep hoping for as far…

Swipe is terrible and i dont know how people even use it

Try downloading Gboard. Been using it for years. Dramatically better than iOS built in, which makes horrible decisions about when and how text is corrected and has worse gesture recognition.

After a relatively short time, I stopped having to look at the keys or think about letters. Touch typing from keyboard transfers over well.

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