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US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

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Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#621

Post by pc86 »

barbariangrunge wrote: post #599
moffkalast wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A real eye opener regarding this has been the ongoing war in Ukraine. For some reason I always had this picture of war being people constantly hiding in bunkers, looting and stealing in a sort of apocalyptic doomsday prepper way, whoever remains working in tank factories around the clock, that sort of thing. But no, their entire country is being blown up on a daily basis, apartments being hit by cruise missiles, stre…

> Life is banal. I wouldn't word it like that

Why not?

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#622

Post by tptacek »

revscat wrote: post #583
tptacek wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatever else those protections might mean, they apply only to disclosures made through official DoD channels, not to interviews given to book authors.

> In accordance with protocols, Grusch provided the Defense Office of Prepublication and Security Review at the Department of Defense with the information he intended to disclose to us. His on-the-record statements were all “cleared for open publication” on April 4 and 6, 2023, in documents provided to us. Source: https://thedebrief.org/intelligence-officials-say-u-s-has-re...

Yes: we all agree that what he's saying is cleared for publication. Because it's nonsense and the DoD doesn't care.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#623

Post by mcpackieh »

speak_plainly wrote: post #322
subsubzero wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Supposedly a few pieces of technology that we use in military and everyday use were created using alien technology. Stealth fighters and holograms. But I have read the book about the engineering/creation of the f-117 stealth fighter at skunkworks and nothing in that airplane doesn't seem like it could be created using currently understood scientific principles. One thing that did stand out was the timeline from creat…

There is not a single invention out in the world today that came from alien technology, that came out of left field, or has no paper trail of terrestrial origin. Holography for example has been a hot topic since the 1600s, combine holography with the invention of photography and you get holograms.

> Holography for example has been a hot topic since the 1600s

I can't figure out what you mean by this, unless you're referring to Pepper's ghost which is not a hologram at all. If you photograph a Pepper's ghost illusion you get a regular photograph, not a hologram.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#624

Post by mcpackieh »

runald wrote: post #613
mcpackieh wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's bayesian reasoning. If I tell you that I predict the sun will explode tomorrow, you should consider the sun's track record of not exploding when evaluating my claim.

There's no bayesian reasoning here, just someone assuming something to be proved to be already true. Statements don't become self-evidently true just because someone assigned probabilities on them. Also, using only past billion occurrences of the sun not blowing up, and then still concluding that the sun will not blow up despite of any recent indications of the sun showing anomalous activity seems a more accurate ana…

Mick West presents rational reasons for why his assumptions are true, he's not simply asserting his assumptions as correct.

> despite of any recent indications of the sun showing anomalous activity

The whole point is that the videos are not in fact the indications of anomalous activity that they're made out to be. There are mundane explanations for all of them.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#625

Post by mcpackieh »

godelski wrote: post #460
mcpackieh wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Very expensive and difficult to produce __is__ exotic technology. Not in the sense of antigravity. Enough money and time can buy you an arbitrarily nice mirror, it doesn't rely on presently unknown to the public attributes of the universe.

> Enough money and time can buy you an arbitrarily nice mirror Yes and no. But I'm going to go with mostly no. The yes is only because over thousands of years we have in fact improved mirror quality, but if we're talking about building a perfect mirror within a 5-10 year time-frame from now, it is definitely no. No matter how much money you spend. A lot of people like to make assumptions about our capacity to build a…

What does "a perfect mirror" even mean? The mirrors produced for the NRO were very good but they're not alien artifacts indicating some paradigm shifting technology gap between government and the private sector. They are roughly comparable to the mirrors produced for astronomical purposes in the same era. Better because they had better funding, but not so much better that anybody should deduce that aliens had anything to do with it.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#626

Post by mcpackieh »

FollowingTheDao wrote: post #309
mcpackieh wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And why are we acting like this is a new phenomenon? It's been going on since at least the 1940's Exactly what has been going on since the 40s though? The Roswell Incident in 1947 was a balloon. There was no evidenced advanced propulsion technology, neither from aliens or the government. It was just a balloon that got blown up into an massive bizarre cultural phenomena of people whispering rumors about alien spacec…

I think thou protest too much.

On the internet, nobody knows that you're secretly a Venusian.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#627

Post by falcrist »

mcpackieh wrote: post #411
godelski wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another part is that people don't realize how within the government, and especially the military, there are a lot of false documents and reports that are sitting around AND highly classified. You do this because there are spies and they will steal shit. You want to make that process noisy. It's also beneficial because you may get your adversary to spend millions or billions studying a thing that isn't even possible.…

> there are a lot of false documents and reports that are sitting around AND highly classified Exactly this. I saw a youtube video a while ago about a recently declassified document from the US Navy which says the USS Seawolf reported hearing signals from survivors on the USS Thresher more than a day after the Thresher went missing. The sonar operators on the Seawolf, no doubt well trained professionals, had themselv…

The only way for the story to make sense is if they weren't resting on the sea floor, and were instead at or above crush depth with neither propulsion or spare ballast capacity to rise to the surface.

It's possible, I suppose. It seems pretty far-fetched.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#628

Post by emmelaich »

runald wrote: post #590
emmelaich wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> he starts from the conclusion that the aliens are not here I'd say assumption not conclusion. It sounds like a good assumption to me.

It's called circular reasoning. Conclusion cites the premises, which in turn the premises cite the conclusion. Evidence (or lack of) is used to prove it self. When you start with a false or circular premise, anything that follows is technically true. It's a powerful (bullshitting) tool that can be used to prove or disprove anything.

absence of is a better default than presence

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#629

Post by seren »

colanderman wrote: post #614
z7 wrote: post #606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one explain the eyewitness testimony of the 4 people involved? >Fravor reported that he saw an object, white and oval, hovering above an ocean disturbance. He estimated that the object was about 40 feet (12 m) long.[7][4] Fravor and another pilot, Alex Dietrich, said in an interview that a total of four people (two pilots and two weapons systems officers in the back seats of the two airplanes) witnessed the…

The history of UFO sightings is nothing but eyewitness testimony, often from groups of people. If there weren't a video this wouldn't have escaped the tabloids. Adding a video which is a textbook demonstration of gimbal+heat tracking behavior does not lend weight to their testimony. EDIT: The testimony you quoted isn't even associated with "Gimbal", it's associated with the decade-earlier "FLIR" video.

But according to Fravor's report, the 2 planes were sent there by their ship because the radar at picked up something. So it means that if it is made up, it involves the 2 pilots and their 2 weapons specialist, plus an undetermined number of radar operators, and their chain of command in the USS Princeton who dispatched them.

So from my understanding, it was picked up by at least one type of sensor.

There is still a probability, there was an artifact on the radar, AND the crew then decided to make up a story, but, Alex Dietrich, the second pilot had just started a few weeks earlier, and it was her first real world mission. I don't think that typical people tries to do a prank on one of their first assignments, on the spot, more so with colleagues they don't know very well.

But it is still possible I guess, even if I have hard time what could be the motivation of everyone involved.

Re: US Congress doubles down on claims of illegal UFO retrieval programs

#630

Post by throwaway743 »

sph wrote: post #607
throwaway743 wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This thread is full of "I don't want to believe and/or can't". If it's legit, could people itt put down their confirmation bias and handle that we're not the smartest around, not top of the food chain, that our governments have lied to us and kept it wrapped sealed through compartmentalization/removed from oversight through third party contractors for decades, have hidden clean energy tech from tax payers so private…

Our greedy, inept, inefficient government, but also our conniving, duplicitous, and machiavellian government that is able to keep aliens a closely guarded secret even from everyone for decades. It's either one, or the other.

Government isn't a monolith.
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