Earlier quoted context omitted.
Reddit has entirely failed at building their ad business, which every other major social site has done successfully. Reddit makes 1$ per user-month on ads, while Instagram makes $35. If they could even get to $2, they would be profitable. The API access issue is largely a side-show to this core problem. The challenge for this is that targeting on reddit is harder than other sites which have lengthy profiles and inter…
> An elegant solution to this problem would likely involve some product tweaks to incentivize users to tell reddit more about themselves, and a refocus on ad sales. How much more information do they need? They already take all that info [1]. I'm pretty sure 99% of the official app users did not turn these settings off. [1] https://i.imgur.com/VpWlCnO.png
Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
481–490 of 614 posts
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#482We (the internet community) made such a terrible mistake with social media. We formed connections and communities and friendships on sites like Facebook and Twitter and Reddit, but those companies need to make money, so those connections are only allowed to exist as long as they are part of a profitable system. How awful it is to reduce human connection to that. To think that I am only allowed to maintain certain soc…
What gives me hope is if you ever take a break from social media you realize how worthless it all is. It really doesn’t hurt to disengage. For similar reasons it’s possible for new networks to show up which disrupt the old, such as TikTok. The point is as individuals we are way less dependent on social media than we imagine.
I agree with this sentiment. I left Facebook and don't miss it in the slightest. Left Twitter long before it was fashionable and don't miss it. It's just a bummer that Reddit is going that direction as well. I've tried to leave Reddit a number of times and then remember it's the only place to get direct, responsive support from my ISP and most of my Google searches include Reddit to see what other people think about a product, service or idea. But would I miss Reddit a year from now? Nope, probably not.
We could do away with all the surveillance capitalism using us as a product and life would probably be fine.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#483Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's more than a profit motive. Profits can be fine. The bigger issue is the need to show unlimited growth on the books. That whole system drives the gradual enshittification of everything.
Everything, including our climate and other basic needs as humans. Wild that it hasn’t been overthrown yet.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#484Earlier quoted context omitted.
We’ve only had this communication capability for the last .01% of human existence. Even 150 years ago, if you wanted to communicate with anyone outside your town, you had to pay a horse based courier what was most likely a very expensive fee. Not to mention the millions of years before that. Did all these previous generations find less satisfaction in life? Well who knows but I argue not. We don’t have to structure o…
> Did all these previous generations find less satisfaction in life? Heck yes. I lived half my life in a non-Internet era. And I can say with absolute certainty, that it was horrible. Finding community, especially for specialized interests, was virtually impossible. Finding specialized information -- completely impossible, unless you had access to a University library. There weren't even efficient ways to find out wh…
By that logic you live in absolute hell compared to the future humans of the year 3000. Doesn’t feel like it though does it?
I’m illustrating the existence of the hedonic treadmill. However much we get in life, somehow it’s always just okay or slightly not good enough.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#485We (the internet community) made such a terrible mistake with social media. We formed connections and communities and friendships on sites like Facebook and Twitter and Reddit, but those companies need to make money, so those connections are only allowed to exist as long as they are part of a profitable system. How awful it is to reduce human connection to that. To think that I am only allowed to maintain certain soc…
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#486The dishonesty continues. > if they are no longer interested in moderating that community They're still interested. They're just protesting your policies. > [if] at least one mod [...] wants to keep the community going, we will respect their decisions and remove those who no longer want to moderate from the mod team. This one takes the cake. They're dangling a carrot: hey, any low-ranked mod interested in taking over…
[I stand corrected, redacting the rest of the comment] In a small defense of Reddit: If subs are private, they are still accessible to subscribers. If the moderators don’t moderate the really bad stuff, Reddit has historically replaced them. I would think the same applies here. It’s hard to argue that people who are not subscribed to a sub are community members. People had plenty of warning to join subs before they w…
Subscription is about curating your homepage, news subscriptions (ugh), etc. Subscription means you want to see and know about popular stuff in that sub. And you can still view stuff you're not subscribed to, if you're an approved member.
The access levels that are allowable are: approved only, public but only approved can submit links, and public. You can also set access on items individually, and lock comments on those items, etc. So it's also possible to just blank or remove all the old posts with a bot (API!) and leave only a "fuck u" thread that's uncommentable.
At that point reddit probably reverts it and calls it vandalism and puts in new mods and starts banning anybody who's tantruming. Like, be disruptive get banned. You have less freedom here than with a TLD registrar (better ask nicely to get a .edu or .mil or .gov cert issued). Their system, their rules, their call. You already agreed to license your content to them. Shreddit could probably even be undone if they have history etc. And there already is a public dataset already on the internet for like... 10y+ now? how does that work exactly?
Who wins in the argument of GDPR vs users having agreed to a perpetual irrevocable license and several other parties already having used those API access to republish those comments under CC (fh-bigquery:reddit-comments, pushift, etc)? Can you revoke an irrevocable license under GDPR as the originator, and if so how does that leave IP licensing in general, just "fuck it GDPR it, it's mine, I don't want a licensee to use it"? I mean probably all social media licenses include something like that, if it's durable then GDPR is relatively meaningless and nobody has to respond to GDPR if they publish their dataaset/API output (interesting outcome perhaps). If it's not durable it kind of fucks up IP law and subassignment in general, everything was always done by an originating creator(s) at some point, then sublicensed to their employer, etc. Can you just be like "patent license revoked, boss, I did the GDPR?".
The idea of Google/etc being forced to publish their codebases under permissive licenses to avoid random "nah fuck you"'s from departing engineers would be an extremely funni legal outcome though, like that would have massive implications for knowledge/creative work in general. Maybe the same thing would happen to social media providers... maybe that paradoxically makes the incentive to publish fh-bigquery:reddit and pushift stronger, because now it's irrevocable. And that's the minimum ask for 3PA tooling more or less.
On the other hand if the CC sublicense holds in any way, most likely it's legal to say "ok this is the vandalism reversion dataset, it's CC, patch it over the api response inside the client" both for the vendor and the others.
I guess to put it another way: would wikipedia have to edit out every line and commit a user has interacted with, if they filed a GDPR? How do you begin to back that out on a word by word basis? Every redditor knew their words were going to be public (for the definition of that subreddit, and potentially public according to future changes of that subreddit). They put it on "wikipedia" knowing the organization ultimately was driving there.
Reddit chooses not to unwind history and revert. But does Reddit have a license to do so? What about Wikipedia? It seems like in this case the answer may be "probably, if they want to, it's just normally not a problem but we can do it if people get disruptive". People licensed their posts to the community, that's why they're outraged that the community is being torn away from them, it cuts both ways unfortunately. But it might also be legal to reboot Reddit using that data, assuming it's all really CC etc.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#487One thing I don't quite understand is how the CEO first claims that only 3% of the user base is using 3rd party apps, and then later claims that "And the opportunity cost of not having those users (3rd part app users) on our platform, on our advertising platform, is really significant" (from https://www.npr.org/2023/06/15/1182457366/reddit-ceo-steve-h... ) Is that 3% of the user base really having such a big impact s…
I use reddit a lot and I hate all these blackouts. I pay reddit premium because I like what the platform gives me back.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#488Earlier quoted context omitted.
Text and links, but then also recommendation algorithms, spam filtering, image hosting, lightning-fast caching systems so that your main feed doesn't take hours to load fetching row by row from MySQL, geographically distributed data centres for redundancy and locality. Then there's the ad engine, which requires user data harvesting, and all of that analytics and analysis and machine learning, and that all gets expens…
If you're a non-profit then you don't need a recommendation engine or an ad engine. You also don't need to self host video and images, at least initially. Reddit, for the longest time, relied on Imgur and embedded video players until they built their own infrastructure. Also, thanks to advances in AI, there is an opportunity for AI moderators for content curation. As far as caching and web scale in general, you don't…
https://scx2.b-cdn.net/gfx/news/2011/googlegrewfr.jpg
Google's first server farm consisted on row after row of regular desktop machines on the floor. Also no server racks.
But sooner or later, you're going to need one of these: https://www.google.ca/about/datacenters/
The thing I would live in constant fear of if I were to host a Mastodon server is that sooner or later, one of your users' posts is going to end up being linked to in a Wired feature article, or a New York Times article, or goes viral for any of a billion reason, and your server is going to end up getting hammered with 10,000 requests a second for a week or a month, which means you're going to be facing a sudden unexpected $3,000 AWS bill. (Not sure what it would actually cost. Anyone?)
I've seen what being linked to in a Wired article does to a web server. It's ugly.
Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#489Re: Reddit Threatens to Remove Moderators from Subreddits Continuing Blackouts
#490We (the internet community) made such a terrible mistake with social media. We formed connections and communities and friendships on sites like Facebook and Twitter and Reddit, but those companies need to make money, so those connections are only allowed to exist as long as they are part of a profitable system. How awful it is to reduce human connection to that. To think that I am only allowed to maintain certain soc…