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Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

theregister.com

641–650 of 778 posts

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cities are much more energy efficient than anything else with the same standard of living.

Perhaps that we do not need the same standard of living

Sure, you give up your fridge and your washing machine first and I'll do it next.

What's that? Silence?

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#642
post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recently I was reading that in Europe, most cars sold don't even have automatic transmission, yet the drivers there are much safer than than people in the US or Australia. There was some speculation that because they shift gears manually, they have to pay more attention to the road and can't do things like drink coffees while driving. They also enjoy driving a lot more than we do. I wonder if other technology would h…

After a recent 3 week driving trip through Europe, I can anecdotally back this up. It’s not even the manual transmission, but also the much smaller roads with no shoulder where at times you meet a car, have to slam on the brakes, and decide in the moment whether you or the other car will back up to a turn out. You have to pay constant attention and there’s little room for looking at phones, eating, etc. In the US we…

This is backed by infrastructure studies. It's called traffic calming and it's done on purpose in places with advanced infrastructure such as the Netherlands.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#643
post #537
post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who feels the same way, I’ve lost all hope for the US in this regard. SUV/truck sales have continued increasing with absolutely zero mainstream discussion about preventing pedestrian deaths. It’s legal to have push bars and tow hitches (thus inhibiting crumple zones) with no purpose other than “protecting” your vehicle at the expense of lives. Even ostensibly pedestrian friendly cities don’t have sufficien…

Excuse me, tow hitches are commonly used for practical purposes. I'm really interested in the case for making tow hitches illegal.

Yeah, I’m not referring to useful ones being actively used for towing. I’m referring to people that leave them in while driving around not towing anything. Some are designed to extend upward as well with no practical towing purpose. Look up pictures of collisions after someone has a tow hitch in and you’ll see what I mean.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#644

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seem to remember there being a number of drain derailments lately. Hardly a great safety record compared to either Mercedes' or Tesla's systems.

Let’s see the fatalities per billion passenger km: Rail: 0.09 Car: 2.52 https://international-railway-safety-council.com/safety-stat... (eu data)

How many fatalities have the aforementioned car systems had? Also European trains seem to run much, much safer than American ones (the derailments I was talking about were in the US), so doesn't seem like the best comparison either.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#645
I just came here to say that we already have autonomous "someone-else's" vehicles out there.

If you're in a bar and want to go back to your place, you call one if such autonomous vehicles. Or you want to go from home to work without needing to care about parking. They are called taxis.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self driving cars are much more likely to be public transport than individually owned. It's also extremely likely that it requires ride-sharing to be viable, which will substantially reduce traffic as well as car ownership (I suspect there may be enough cost pressure that most self-driving vehicles are more like minibuses than cars, which would also help a lot with pollution and congestion, but this may require regul…

"Self driving cars are much more likely to be public transport than individually owened" I've only seen this as a 'just so' greenwash pr story from the automotive industry to offset the projected 300% increase in total road miles driven anually. Please explain why peole would be compelled to ditch their multidude of private cars just because they now come with a 24/7 free driver included?

Because owning a car is expensive. And owning a self-driving car is likely to be even more expensive. If you can still get the same convenience for a far lower cost by just using a taxi, why would you continue to own a car? (Also, this is something the automotive industry does not want, as it will reduce their sales substantially. This is something that is claimed by self-driving companies which are not also automotive companies, and most people who analyse the economics of self-driving, especially looking at which technologies which are more likely to succeed).

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But we already let learner drivers try things out on the road, and their supervisors can’t even take control. Human drivers crash and make mistakes too… where is the uproar for allowing them to drive? Where as Tesla only allows fully licensed drivers and until recently only pretty good ones at that. I think you’re just regurgitating the standard anti-Tesla talking points… and avoided the questions on the fact Mercede…

I don't know the US, but in Europe supervisors definitely can take control - at least for acceleration / breaking. I also think Tesla's approach is the most efficient one, however I do have a problem with their advertising, which is misleading to say the least. I think we kind of all agree it's a beta version, and they 'develop it in the open'. But it's been at least 5 years they say it's pretty much FSD - their firs…

When I took my sons out to practice driving I most certainly could not take control.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#648
post #367

What do we want from self driving cars? Naturally I wand a car I can summon from the pub that will drive me the 20km, over country roads, to my house while I mix cocktails or have a nap. That may never happen, current technology does not seem up to it. Then what? Modern cruise control, that keeps my car a constant distance form the car in front (unless it roars off at a speed higher that what I am comfortable with) i…

Recently I was reading that in Europe, most cars sold don't even have automatic transmission, yet the drivers there are much safer than than people in the US or Australia. There was some speculation that because they shift gears manually, they have to pay more attention to the road and can't do things like drink coffees while driving. They also enjoy driving a lot more than we do. I wonder if other technology would h…

As an American who drove a manual car in Chicago for a few years, trust me, there are ways to eat and drink while rowing your own gears.

Most European countries have far higher barriers to entry for driver's licenses compared to the USA. A German driver's license costs around $2000 to obtain. I spent $2000 on my first car (in 2018). Combine high financial barrier with competent public transit, and people who would be bad drivers just don't drive at all.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Sorry cities are much more efficient than any other form of human living [0]. It is suburbs and rural sprawl that creates the energy waste. Population drift towards the latter may cause the hollowing of cities which lead to crime and transport inefficiency. [0] https://theconversation.com/suburban-living-the-worst-for-ca...

"Cities are more efficient, suburbs and rural sprawl are inefficient and bad" depends on: A: the design of the suburb B: the underlying economy they're built in C: cultural factors.

When the US contained major manufacturing, it was efficient to have large suburban sprawl - you could build spread out industrial hubs on the outskirts of town.

When the cities were not safe, it did not matter what you said - people left.

"Efficiency" is not a magic word, it has to apply to a particular resource, and does have to consider all costs. Cities are in fact, more efficient in terms of transit costs (of all types).

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#650

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, that's the elephant in the room. Self driving cars by virtue of being self driving can be sent on trips by themselves without requiring the driver to be present. The presence of a driver is a limiting factor, once that one drops away there will be many more trips. Suddenly kids can use the car and all kinds of pick up and delivery jobs become cost effective in a way that they are not today.

Can’t wait for those human-less boxes rolling downtown carefree… what a fun time we’re gonna have painting and blasting their sensors.

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