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OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

asahilinux.org

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Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#331

Post by troad »

_cenw wrote: post #329
troad wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This raises interesting moral questions that I'm not sure I have an answer to. It's not really all that much of a moral conundrum. Marcan's belief - expressed a number of times on his Mastodon - appears to be that he can prevent other people from discussing something, for the sole reason he doesn't want it discussed. It's not a particularly defensible position in an open society. In particular, he is upset that peo…

You are misunderstanding. You can discuss your conspiracies anywhere you want, just not on a post pointing to the people that have to deal with the fallout of your unfounded conjecture. Also assuming there is a "fake contributor", who cares under which names contributions are split up? The work still got one. Also, it is absolutely not your project, you don't get to demand people show their ID when they write code fo…

> Also assuming there is a "fake contributor", who cares under which names contributions are split up? The work still got one. Also, it is absolutely not your project, you don't get to demand people show their ID when they write code for a project.

If I contribute my code to an open source project, then I - as the copyright holder - agree to license my work under an open licence.

If I use an OSS project, I am using other people's copyrighted work under an open licence from them. Without that licence, I have no legal basis on which to use that work.

Only real people can (currently) hold copyright. If person X writes some code, but the licence (incorrectly) attributes the copyright to person Y, and person Y purports to give me an open licence to use that work, then - crucially - I have no license from the actual copyright holder (person X) to use their work.

Until an effective open source license is made, this code is not open source; it is completely proprietary. If person X chooses to sue you for copyright infringement, it is no defence to say that you're using it under a license from person Y, because person Y had no right to give you that licence.

This is a major ethical and legal problem. I would be very wary of the Asahi codebase.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#332

Post by IshKebab »

jb1991 wrote: post #283
IshKebab wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that's nonsense. They already have bootcamp.

That’s incorrect. Bootcamp has not existed for a while now.

Looks like it still exists, they just never ported it to the ARM chips, presumably because nobody wants ARM Windows.

In any case that's really irrelevant to the main point which is that Apple appears to have no objection to other OSes running on their laptops.

Though I wouldn't be surprised if they don't go out of their way to help and make it de facto impossible through secure boot systems.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#333

Post by _cenw »

troad wrote: post #331
_cenw wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are misunderstanding. You can discuss your conspiracies anywhere you want, just not on a post pointing to the people that have to deal with the fallout of your unfounded conjecture. Also assuming there is a "fake contributor", who cares under which names contributions are split up? The work still got one. Also, it is absolutely not your project, you don't get to demand people show their ID when they write code fo…

> Also assuming there is a "fake contributor", who cares under which names contributions are split up? The work still got one. Also, it is absolutely not your project, you don't get to demand people show their ID when they write code for a project. If I contribute my code to an open source project, then I - as the copyright holder - agree to license my work under an open licence. If I use an OSS project, I am using o…

If you wanted to split hairs this thin, you wouldn't use any project with at least one german citizen as contributor, since they can never truly yield all copyright on a work. You'll be fine. Anonymous contributions to free software (or even entire releases done anonymously, e.g. Bitcoin) are not actually uncommon.

As I said, very weird hangup to have, definitely not motivated by other reasons.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#335

Post by troad »

_cenw wrote: post #333
troad wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also assuming there is a "fake contributor", who cares under which names contributions are split up? The work still got one. Also, it is absolutely not your project, you don't get to demand people show their ID when they write code for a project. If I contribute my code to an open source project, then I - as the copyright holder - agree to license my work under an open licence. If I use an OSS project, I am using o…

If you wanted to split hairs this thin, you wouldn't use any project with at least one german citizen as contributor, since they can never truly yield all copyright on a work. You'll be fine. Anonymous contributions to free software (or even entire releases done anonymously, e.g. Bitcoin) are not actually uncommon. As I said, very weird hangup to have, definitely not motivated by other reasons.

> If you wanted to split hairs this thin, you wouldn't use any project with at least one german citizen as contributor, since they can never truly yield all copyright on a work.

Nor can anyone else, copyright is not generally 'destructible'. That's why it's a licence. The holder keeps the copyright, but licenses the work to the general public. (Assignments are another way to achieve something like this, provided the assignee then licenses the work.)

I assume what you're referring to is inalienable moral rights - hence the reference to Germany - but those are a feature of many (most?) of the world's legal systems. They are included in one of the revisions to the Berne Convention, if I recall correctly, which is an international treaty on intellectual property.

I understand you're sceptical, but the legal dimension of OSS does matter. Using copyrighted material without a licence would constitute a major business risk. I would appreciate it if you could kindly refrain from making ungenerous assumptions about the intentions of others.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#336

Post by judge2020 »

pbasista wrote: post #327
judge2020 wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That page doesn't include noreferrer on the article link for me.

"rel" is an attribute of several HTML tags, including the anchor tag [0]. It is not something that would be visible in the URL. The presence of this attribute instructs the client to not send the HTTP header "Referer" [1] when making a request to the target URL. [0] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Attributes... [1] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTTP/Headers/Re...

I know, I'm saying that it's not in the `rel=` on that article link on the linked page. Just noopener, which is of course included on every link.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#337

Post by troad »

_cenw wrote: post #330
troad wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there is constant transphobia against Asahi contributors on display on this site Could you be so kind as to link me to an example? People have discussed Marcan's anime alter ego, certainly, but I've never seen anything transphobic in the slightest. Maybe it's all flagged before I get to see it, but I honestly can't figure out what you might even be referring to. I enjoy reading Asahi updates when they come up, so I…

> People have discussed Marcan's anime alter ego This is pure and poor conjecture, just like the rumor (originating on chan boards and KF) that a person close to marcan had faked suicide. Exactly this sort of rumor mill is what is wrong with HN linking to Asahi developers. > As a 'queer person' myself, I find that statement utterly ludicrous and I reject it completely. Are you a cis gay? I remember a few cases where…

I can honestly say I've never, ever, heard anyone call anyone else these terms on Hacker News. I don't think I've ever even heard those terms before. It sounds like you might be very online, in a way that seems to be making you unhappy.

Some of my most upvoted comments on here have been from a 'queer' perspective. It helps to assume good intentions and engage with others constructively and in good faith.

I must admit, I feel saddened by your dismissiveness of certain 'queer people'. You have no idea who I am, what my identity is, and yet you so casually dismiss members of the marginalised group you purport to be defending. How callous of you.

Perhaps the reason I can so easily dismiss your hysterical claim that HN is unsafe is that - in my day - 'unsafe for queer people' meant 'reasonable likelihood of getting a brick to the face', and not 'seeing words online you don't agree with'.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#338

Post by _cenw »

troad wrote: post #337
_cenw wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People have discussed Marcan's anime alter ego This is pure and poor conjecture, just like the rumor (originating on chan boards and KF) that a person close to marcan had faked suicide. Exactly this sort of rumor mill is what is wrong with HN linking to Asahi developers. > As a 'queer person' myself, I find that statement utterly ludicrous and I reject it completely. Are you a cis gay? I remember a few cases where…

I can honestly say I've never, ever, heard anyone call anyone else these terms on Hacker News. I don't think I've ever even heard those terms before. It sounds like you might be very online, in a way that seems to be making you unhappy. Some of my most upvoted comments on here have been from a 'queer' perspective. It helps to assume good intentions and engage with others constructively and in good faith. I must admit…

this is very dismissive for how much you're projecting i'm dismissing you. it's okay if you can't relate to me, just don't assume you understand.

hn is unsafe in the way that it provides zero control over what you have submitted and a perfect history of your posts, mostly set in stone unless you email an administrator. at least reddit lets you self-service delete posts.

those are perfect conditions for a certain kind of group that spend way too much time digging up and correlating info to then start harassment campaigns that exceed 'seeing words online you don't agree with' quite often.

you can of course now go on to scold me and others with this problem about how we need to up our opsec or shouldn't post in the first place. i find such arguments, if you were to make them, entirely unconvincing. being aware of your risk profile is one thing, shifting all the blame for making it harder to retroactively rectify little pieces of information (these people found a place from a blurry 500x500 picture of a parking lot out a window) on the user is just a bad excuse for shitty UX.

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#339

Post by renewedrebecca »

troad wrote: post #326
101011 wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This raises interesting moral questions that I'm not sure I have an answer to. For one, I don't believe this place fosters a hostile environment, although it's definitely a place where people love to tell you how you're technically wrong about something. For another, I would guess that there are a very limited number of websites that would opt into this sort of anti-traffic behavior. Hacker news could certainly choos…

> This raises interesting moral questions that I'm not sure I have an answer to. It's not really all that much of a moral conundrum. Marcan's belief - expressed a number of times on his Mastodon - appears to be that he can prevent other people from discussing something, for the sole reason he doesn't want it discussed. It's not a particularly defensible position in an open society. In particular, he is upset that peo…

Quit with the gaslighting. It's not about an anime avatar, and you know it.

The problem is more that HN is perceived, with good reason, to be transphobic, and Asahi has several trans developers. This is also the reason why a couple of other people I won't mention don't want HN to link to their projects either, because for every link, several people will bitch in the comments about the validity of their gender and pronouns. (As if creating a web app somehow makes one an authority in biology.)

I mean, obviously, it's not like everybody who comments here takes part in the abuse, but when you spend every damn day of your life seeing it and depending on where you live, possibly being harassed by the government over it too, HN turns out to be one more place where you simply can't have any peace.

(And honestly, even if Lina is a anime alter ego, which you haven't proven, and only suspect, why the fuck do you care? Don't you have something better to spend your time on?)

Re: OpenGL 3.1 on Asahi Linux

#340

Post by mrpopo »

judge2020 wrote: post #336
pbasista wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"rel" is an attribute of several HTML tags, including the anchor tag [0]. It is not something that would be visible in the URL. The presence of this attribute instructs the client to not send the HTTP header "Referer" [1] when making a request to the target URL. [0] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Attributes... [1] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTTP/Headers/Re...

I know, I'm saying that it's not in the `rel=` on that article link on the linked page. Just noopener, which is of course included on every link.

It is. When I open the source, I see this:

http://www.jwz.org/blog/2011/10/eff-declares-premature-victo..." rel="noreferrer">Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

Might be that the method is different on a specific browser, but most likely you are looking in the wrong place.

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