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EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

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Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#861

Post by Dylan16807 »

throwaway2990 wrote: post #859
Dylan16807 wrote: post #849

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the spec's fault. I'm not defending the defective hardware. The cable, or one of the devices involved, isn't following the spec .

100% is the specs fault. It tries to solve all of life’s problems. But only creates more. There should be 1 spec for a cable. Period. It should be universal.

For basic charging cables, there is only one kind.

And the spec was ignored.

You think removing unrelated cables from the spec would make manufacturers do a better job at basic charging cables? I doubt it.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#862

Post by Dylan16807 »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #860
Dylan16807 wrote: post #857

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a source for those numbers?

'dare say' usually means that the source is the writer.

Your first paragraph didn't have "dare say". And you can't just add that as a disclaimer to any factual statement to make you immune to needing evidence. If you made that guess based on how much you like the ports, then you're wasting everyone's time. But again, you said "real world failure rate is much higher" as a flat-out fact.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#863

Post by MichaelZuo »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #862
MichaelZuo wrote: post #860

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'dare say' usually means that the source is the writer.

Your first paragraph didn't have "dare say". And you can't just add that as a disclaimer to any factual statement to make you immune to needing evidence. If you made that guess based on how much you like the ports, then you're wasting everyone's time. But again, you said "real world failure rate is much higher" as a flat-out fact.

The previous comment did not mention any numerical figure in the first paragraph, only that rate would be much higher due to the aforementioned reasons. I left it intentionally ambiguous by not specifying a number for a reason.

The rest of your comment is not worth a substantive reply considering almost any passing reader can see through the attempt to stop the conversation with a dismissal.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#864

Post by dang »

Sakos wrote: post #790
ZekeSulastin wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we reading the same HN?

Yes, you're just part of the group that agrees with them, so you don't recognize it.

Exactly! and the opposite group works exactly the same way:

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26148870

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#865

Post by detourdog »

tankenmate wrote: post #850
detourdog wrote: post #830

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have a problem with vendors doing this. I prefer standards but since one side of the cable is a standard I think it is fine. Implementing ports cost money . Developing for Apple customers costs money. One can choose their market based on costs. I understand the lightening standard show it's age and is in need of an upgrade. Why the EU is involved in the decision making process is lost to me.

The EU's stance is primarily about e-waste, and secondarily about lower costs through competition. Having one standard does a good job of achieving both; lower costs through economies of scale, and less waste because when you get a new phone you don't need to replace all your accessories. It's not perfect but it is better than the alternatives. Having one gate keeper (for example "Made for iPhone" USDx per device / c…

The gatekeeper is only minding their own product and customers. I don't buy the e-waste issue. The only extra thing the lightening cable creates is the very cable itself. How much e-waste does a cable with a single type of connector create? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I certainly don't see a moral problem.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#866

Post by detourdog »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #835
detourdog wrote: post #677

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry about that. Yes USB-2 is the limiting factor. I don't think it is quite as bad as you stated. They made 2 statements one about the tech being 13 years old. I agreed that the tech was 13 years old. Admitting that I felt I was implying the limits of the lightening port were dated and had technical limits. I guess if the original poster hadn't made the gratuitous comment I would have been more focused on answering…

The limitations are not a matter of Lightning being old. USB-C is almost as old.

USB-C didn't exist in a usable ratified standard at the introduction of Lightening. 4 years is a long time in tech.

If the EU wanted a standard port for charging. I believe induction charge port would have been a better standard to work on. Think how simple an induction charging standard could be.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#867

Post by tankenmate »

detourdog wrote: post #865
tankenmate wrote: post #850

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU's stance is primarily about e-waste, and secondarily about lower costs through competition. Having one standard does a good job of achieving both; lower costs through economies of scale, and less waste because when you get a new phone you don't need to replace all your accessories. It's not perfect but it is better than the alternatives. Having one gate keeper (for example "Made for iPhone" USDx per device / c…

The gatekeeper is only minding their own product and customers. I don't buy the e-waste issue. The only extra thing the lightening cable creates is the very cable itself. How much e-waste does a cable with a single type of connector create? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I certainly don't see a moral problem.

I realise you don't buy the e-waste issue, but the EU does; I don't mean this in any derogatory way, but the EU cares more about e-waste than you do. Primarily in an economic fashion; waste is costly at a government and social level. Also in the EU it is an political cost as the EU public actively votes on this issue (various green parties are in government in various coalitions in various governments as well as having a sizeable influence through the EU parliament either as primary green parties or green leaning parties). EU politics is far more nuanced that US politics, mainly because proportional representation which is exceedingly common as opposed to first past the post like in the US and UK.

So the EU are, in effect, voting in their own self interest. And again it's not just the cables, but the chargers as well; the EU forced mobile phone companies to stop packaging chargers with phones as well.

Re: EU sends Apple stark warning over USB-C charging on new iPhones

#868

Post by oittaa »

detourdog wrote: post #866
Dylan16807 wrote: post #835

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The limitations are not a matter of Lightning being old. USB-C is almost as old.

USB-C didn't exist in a usable ratified standard at the introduction of Lightening. 4 years is a long time in tech. If the EU wanted a standard port for charging. I believe induction charge port would have been a better standard to work on. Think how simple an induction charging standard could be.

If you would've read the EU law, they considered wireless charging, but at the moment the landscape is changing very rapidly. They'll let the industry collaborate first, but if Apple or some other company won't play the ball, EU will step in again.
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