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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#151

Post by maccard »

vetinari wrote: post #146
3np wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to give Microsoft an out here but really? The equivalent for this on iOS or Android would be allowing opening links in a different browser and web view engine. The equivalent Microsoft apps on mobile OSs aren't degraded - they aren't even allowed to exist in the first place. Microsoft is bringing the desktop experience in line with mobile here. Doesn't make it less terrible but contrasting Apple and Google as bet…

> The equivalent for this on iOS or Android would be allowing opening links in a different browser and web view engine. In Android, all my links open in Firefox. I don't see any issue there. Might serve as an inspiration to Microsoft ;)

I have that setting set, and various links still open in chrome instead of firefox for me. In particular, links that are opened via gmail, maps or the "google" search widget.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#152

Post by tssva »

supriyo-biswas wrote: post #36
peoplefromibiza wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only instance of Apple doing that I’m aware of is Not allowing alternative browsers on their most successful platform: iOS also: - EU forced Apple to use USB-C like everybody else - EU is forcing Apple to allow side loading of apps Apple is one of the worst offenders ever when it's about vendor lock in

Because one is a clearly declared policy that anyone can look up (even though you, or regulators of a certain country, disagree with it). I’m sure there’d be a lot less outrage if it was Microsoft’s policy that other rendering engines (or browsers) were disallowed, instead of being sneaky and trying to fake error messages, degrading user experiences, and the like. Further, it could be argued that dynamic code executi…

> Because one is a clearly declared policy that anyone can look up (even though you, or regulators of a certain country, disagree with it).

Microsoft has now clearly declared this policy. The basis of the article is the message sent to IT admins clearly declaring it.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#153

Post by lozenge »

lifty wrote: post #79
croes wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not VS Codium?

Is there any usability difference between the two?

Initially you just didn't get Settings Sync as it uses a Microsoft account and you had to use a different extensions gallery (but the MS one still lets you download extensions as a file to install into Codium). Nowadays you also lose Remote Development, Codespaces, Pylance, some C# features, and various other MS authored extensions.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#154

Post by dahauns »

nequo wrote: post #81
IceWreck wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft apps exist on Android and they're not forced to open links in Chrome on Android. If the user chooses, they can open on Microsoft Edge on Android. The user can set their own browser preference - and Google doesn't force them. Apple doesn't allow other browser engines but it's on them. None of these bug tech corps are in the right here, but MS is being more anti-competitive than most.

Edge and Chrome use the same engine, don’t they? So the correct iOS parallel is not Apple’s refusal to allow non-WebKit engines. But Apple’s hypothetical refusal to allow links to be opened in WebKit-flavored Firefox. Which, for the record, it does let you do.

>Edge and Chrome use the same engine, don’t they?

To be precise: No, they don't. Their engines are based on the same codebase, but they still are running their own installed engines.

In contrast, Apple doesn't just refuse to allow non-WebKit engines. It requires everyone to use the pre-installed, Apple-provided engine. You can't use your own build of WebKit.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#156

Post by grishka »

oaiey wrote: post #80

Am I the only one who sees the technical aspect here: They literally write in this article that this is about embedding web pages next to the chat/email/whatever. That means in-memory over contracted hosting api etc. When I would own, e.g. MS Teams or Outlook, the hell I would love to have a dependency on the internal Firefox hosting API which can break any other day (just a example ... firefox is cool) or introducin…

How about only enabling this functionality when Edge is the user's default browser? We somehow managed without it for several decades.

Force-opening another browser despite user-configured defaults is utterly disrespectful to the user. You're trying to frame it as something helpful but it's not helpful in any way whatsoever. It interferes with the user getting their job done using a tool you made.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#157

Post by thatnerdyguy »

oaiey wrote: post #80

Am I the only one who sees the technical aspect here: They literally write in this article that this is about embedding web pages next to the chat/email/whatever. That means in-memory over contracted hosting api etc. When I would own, e.g. MS Teams or Outlook, the hell I would love to have a dependency on the internal Firefox hosting API which can break any other day (just a example ... firefox is cool) or introducin…

This is the correct take that should be at the top. They aren't opening the links in Edge, they are opening the links in an embedded window implemented using Edge.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#158

Post by reaperducer »

spaniard89277 wrote: post #98
isanjay wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say Linux doesn't have this type of nonsense at all.

Mmm, there's some of this stuff in Ubuntu, forcing people to use snaps.

Ubuntu also displays an advertisement every time I log in:

  Get cloud support with Ubuntu Advantage Cloud Guest:
  http://www.ubuntu.com/business/services/cloud

  * Introducing Expanded Security Maintenance for Applications.
  Receive updates to over 25,000 software packages with your
  Ubuntu Pro subscription. Free for personal use.

  https://ubuntu.com/pro

  Expanded Security Maintenance for Applications is not enabled.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#159

Post by taspeotis »

nazgulsenpai wrote: post #70
taspeotis wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Used to be good but they’ve crapped it up with shit like coupons, follow this creator (what the fuck?), the “smart” text selection menu and “rich” link copying. I don’t set up a new Edge profile often but I have to remember to turn off like 5 or 6 things each time to make it somewhat usable.

I'm forced to use Edge on work PC and that context menu when selecting text is wildly unpredictable -- sometimes the only "Search for (selected text)" is Search Bing Sidebar. And its slow as molasses if you ever make the mistake of clicking it.

Turn it off from the … menu that pops up near it

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#160

Post by masklinn »

eertami wrote: post #73
masklinn wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not allowing alternative browsers on their most successful platform: iOS The huge difference is that this is the blanket application of a rule which has reasonable justifications. You can certainly criticise Apple for being a control-freak company, but that's not exactly a new trait. And it's not Apple leveraging one monopoly (they don't have) into trying to take over an other domain as a new entrant. iOS started f…

> Which was almost certainly on Apple's timeline anyway, though we'll never know for sure. They released USB-C macbooks in 2015, 8 years ago. Clearly they had no intention of moving to USB-C on iPhones, prior to the EU ruling. The extra few years selling cables so that you can plug your brand new Apple laptop in to your brand new Apple phone was probably a fun little profit exercise, if not comically anti-consumer/an…

> They released USB-C macbooks in 2015, 8 years ago. Clearly they had no intention of moving to USB-C on iPhones, prior to the EU ruling.

Utter nonsense, which completely ignores the historical and third-party background: the replacement of the dock connector by Lightning was a huge shift as it was very common for devices to have built-in dock connectors which became useless pins overnight (there were literally cars with dock connectors). As necessary as the transition was in the long run, it basically made apple swear to keep lightning alive for at least as long as the DC was.

And there is a clear counter-example: they've been slowly inching support in from the devices least likely to use hard-set connectors: first the 3rd gen ipad pro in 2018, then the 10th gen ipad in 2020, 6th gen mini in 2021, 5th gen Air in 2022.

> The extra few years selling cables so that you can plug your brand new Apple laptop in to your brand new Apple phone was probably a fun little profit exercise

More nonsense, apple literally doesn't want you to plug one into the other, they've been stripping wired phone-related features from macos as fast as they could be bothered to, moving them to either wireless (airdrop) or cloud.

> if not comically anti-consumer/anti-environment.

Yes indeed, the anti-consumer and anti-environment move of letting users upgrading from one iphone to the next not have to replace all their cables.

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