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Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

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Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#141

>Halfway through, a sundial shows the time. I'd love to know how that works in a tunnel!

Talk about not only burying but practically omitting the lede!

Apparently it's quite the impressive underground sundial.

https://bicyclenetwork.com.au/newsroom/2023/03/30/worlds-lon...

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/the-worlds-longest...

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/worlds-longest-cyclin...

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#142
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, not exactly. Pedestrians are heavier than cars in terms of pounds per square foot. Bridges are designed for extreme loads, including pessimistic pattern loading, and the requirements for pedestrian bridges aren’t any less safety critical. (edit: I designed this bridge: https://www.google.com/maps/@47.597616,-122.3297804,3a,75y,7... )

Yeah, the potential loading is annoying. I remember wondering why predestrian/cycle bridges were always so annoyingly narrow despite having low loads. The issue is of course that they have to be strong enough to support being crammed with hundreds of people when everyone is there to watch the local fireworks/rowing race/anything else that's happening, even if that happens almost never.

This is interesting! But how does a dense crowd of people compare to a queue of lorries carrying cement or building materials in terms of mass per square metre?

Let's try to find some data ... ... ... A fully loaded Hanson cement lorry seems to be 32 tonnes / 2.55 m / 9.15 m, which is about 1.4 tonnes per square metre. That corresponds to 20 x 70 kg people per square metre, which would be a disaster whether or not the floor gives way, unless it's a very special kind of crowd (acrobats or something).

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#143
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'Everybody has a car and bicycle...' I'm not sure this is true, but, on the wider point of cars v cycles it comes down to the usual problem of neither not wanting to share the same space. I have lived in Spain, though mainly live in the UK, and in either place I would not feel safe riding a bike (or scooter) on a public road. I should add that car drivers and bike riders can be as bad as each other, it's just that ca…

As a cyclist, I don't have an issue sharing space with other traffic, but I do have an issue with the hyper-aggressive drivers that seek to scare and/or injure cyclists by not giving them enough space when overtaking. There's also the abusive drivers that shout at you and beep their horn at you if they disagree with any choices that you've made such as which road to use. Drivers and riders are hardly comparable in te…

As a cyclist in a town with a lot of cyclist, I see less aggressive behaviour in my town, than in the countryside where people are not used to cyclist. I was discussing with a fellow cyclist and we agreed that some countryside places were particularly full of aggressive drivers.

The more cyclist you have, the less aggressive it becomes

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#144
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I lived in Boston, there's basically no way I'm getting to the mountains, north shore, Cape Cod, western suburbs/exurbs where a lot of people I know live, etc. without a car that I either own, rent, or someone else does. The city itself has a pretty good public transit system and there's even a pretty good commuter rail--but that's designed for coming into the city from suburban train stations with parking lots. S…

Yeah, my impression visiting the US has been that once you leave a big city, things become difficult to navigate alarmingly quickly. It's a bit different here; the suburbs and other cities and towns are usually fairly accessible via public transport.

I think that's generally true. While it's not like you can easily get to every corner of the British Isles or Western Europe generally without a car, there's a lot you can do out of Dublin or London with public transit and maybe the odd cab ride. Generally good as Boston's public transit system is, other than taking the train to New York City, flying somewhere, or taking a bus to someplace that is mostly not very interesting without car transportation on the other end, your options are pretty limited beyond what's covered by the greater metro transit system.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#145
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One absurd but conventionally normal thing is that cities have to build wider streets just because car drivers will inevitably transform them into parking lots, on both sides, halving their width. Old streets often seem narrow, but they aren't really narrow when they aren't full of parked cars.

It would be lovely to see parked cars disappear if autonomous cars become common enough. However, that would also rely on people deciding against car ownership and moving over to a shared vehicle model.

Autonomous electric cars solve only some of the problems cars create while exarcebating others. In a world where semiconductors and rare minerals already cause a lot of geopolitical tensions, do you really think it is feasible to migrate most of the world cars to autonomous electric?

There is only one solution that solves all of the problems car create and has several other benefits. Rethink the urban and infrastructure development for walkability and shorter travels. We can't avoid it, like it or not.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Rotterdam they close the Maastunnel to cyclists and pedestrians at night. There are also people stationed in it during the day at either end. I don't see why Amsterdam couldn't do the same.

A tunnel that you can't use at night makes it significant less useful. I really enjoy returning home by bike at night when public transport has stopped or is running on significantly reduced capacity.

I wouldn't say significant. The vast majority of cyclists will use it mainly (or only) to travel to and from offices/schools/universities/shops. A tunnel that's closed at night will still be really useful. Especially if the alternative is not having a tunnel due to safety concerns.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#147

Rotherhithe tunnel in London screams to be repurposed this way -- to become "colorfully lit, art-lined" thing where psychologists give input on how to make it more welcoming

I'd be very very surprised if this became reality. There's no political force to make actual improvements in London, or in the UK as a whole.

>There's no political force to make actual improvements in London, or in the UK as a whole.

"The Youth", so rather tend to make things as colourful - sadly, as colourful they may be illegal.

*Banksy excepted.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A tunnel that you can't use at night makes it significant less useful. I really enjoy returning home by bike at night when public transport has stopped or is running on significantly reduced capacity.

I wouldn't say significant. The vast majority of cyclists will use it mainly (or only) to travel to and from offices/schools/universities/shops. A tunnel that's closed at night will still be really useful. Especially if the alternative is not having a tunnel due to safety concerns.

if you are going to invest 100's of millions probably better to do it right. Current idea is a bridge far away from the central station which is even more silly.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#149

>Halfway through, a sundial shows the time. I'd love to know how that works in a tunnel!

Talk about not only burying but practically omitting the lede! Apparently it's quite the impressive underground sundial. https://bicyclenetwork.com.au/newsroom/2023/03/30/worlds-lon... https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/the-worlds-longest... https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/worlds-longest-cyclin...

So it's an art installation reminiscent of a sundial, not an actual sundial.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#150

Rotherhithe tunnel in London screams to be repurposed this way -- to become "colorfully lit, art-lined" thing where psychologists give input on how to make it more welcoming

I'd be very very surprised if this became reality. There's no political force to make actual improvements in London, or in the UK as a whole.

> There's no political force to make actual improvements in London, or in the UK as a whole.

HS2 was an attempt at an infrastructure project for the long term greater good but quickly devolved into nothing but bad news cycles.

Everyone is too busy flinging shit and whipping out soundbites to actually do anything, in part because anything worthwhile is hard and mistakes are more punishing than not trying?

It all just feels so inevitable and I don't understand what stops other countries getting into the same spiral of short termism

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