Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and enough that you don’t need to deal with other people (what hell is, to wit) This is actually a new phenomenon. I'm not sure if it's just because I'm older, but I've literally grown to see this shift in mindset. There was a time when it was common to invite neighbors over for dinner, now more often than not, it seems like people want to have bigger fences and less interaction with their community. Meanwhile, all…
A lot of people, myself included, get tired of dealing with people as we get older. We have to deal with people for the majority of our lives, especially during our schooling and working years. Once we've accumulated enough to retire into the countryside with no need to give a fuck to anyone it becomes a very appealing change of scenery.
Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
101–109 of 109 posts
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
Our future was robbed between the 1960s and now. Crazy great things have happened - usually thanks to the best of us. But the worst of us have been pulling the same mega-destructive stunts for decades, and they keep getting away with it. There are good reasons to have optimism, but like... We were violently mugged, and are bleeding. We need to do something about all that before worrying that our outlook isn't rosy en…
Nothing was robbed or destroyed - not sure why you adopt that defeatist attitude. The future could probably be all yours.
Do I really need to go on? Yes, we were mugged. Yes, it was violent, and yes, we are bleeding. There is a fossil fuel and plastic industry rep right over there, with a smoking gun, saying we all need to do our part to recycle with a smirk on their face.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#103Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree that the problem isn't progress, and that there are problems being denied. I don't think the root of the problem is most people's human nature though. Culture has been cynically and scientifically hacked by megamedia conglomerates, blasting brains with full volume fear porn 24h a day for decades over every outlet. This is great for media, great for politicians, great for advertisers like insurance companies t…
This sounds like a compelling argument to me. So what could actually be done about the fear porn? To what extent are people aware of the effects of fear-mongering / click-bait media able to make other choices if offered alternatives? Because surely people will actually feel better if they do. Would neutral-to-hopeful media stories be able to reach enough people? If we let go of the goal of maximizing profits, would i…
> what could actually be done about the fear porn?
The short answer is, I don't know what can be done. The people doing it are doing it because it's very profitable for them, and not just because fear grabs attention. Their corporate sponsors love having control of the narrative.
I don't think I could pull even one person out of their fear bubble, either the CNN flavour or the Fox flavour. All you can do is try to help them feel safe, and loved. But it's like having a drug addict in the family; it's a lot of work and very often there isn't much you can do.
You need to go after the drug pusher, and the manufacturer, and take away their control of the fear supply and distribution.
That's a "radical" and monumental task, which can only be begun when enough people recognize the disease that's attacking them. Very smart and effective people have tried to do this for decades, and been smeared for their efforts. Witness Assange, Chomsky, Klein, etc.
> To what extent are people aware of the effects of fear-mongering / click-bait media able to make other choices if offered alternatives?
Again, I feel that the correct analogy here is that of a drug addict. Fear-porn corporate news is heroin - bad for you, but highly addictive. What you're talking about here is like going up to a junkie and offering them an organic apple, or a tasty hummus sandwich. Sure, they'd feel better if they swapped needles for nutrition, but bruh - not gonna happen.
> Would neutral-to-hopeful media stories be able to reach enough people?
They're out there. They often do grab attention, and a lot of people really love stories like that. But they don't trigger that drug-reflex like the shock-terror-drivel that corporate news gushes every minute of the day.
Gather all the volunteers you like - you're still offering apples to heroin addicts.
> what is needed to start doing this and reaching people with it, right now?
Treat fear-porn like heroin, and use similar interventions. Take control of the fear-porn, make it safe, and offer it in small doses in safe environments to addicts. Make society so safe and good that people aren't interested in heroin/fear-porn.
Now, can you do this without the fear-drug gangs doing anything and everything to stop you from accomplishing this? In America?
“We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.” - Karl Rove.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#104Earlier quoted context omitted.
It‘s the Singularity talk from 2009 all over again … Why would they live to 150? They won‘t. They will die with 95, just like everyone else.
Well, who knows what genetic advances we'll make in 40 years. We squashed a pandemic in two years based on research that had been percolating for ten years. People don't die of old age, they die of ailments that accumulate through age. The more of those we fix, the longer people live. I'm not confident of the 150 number, but larger generational cohorts above 100? You bet.
Take a look at the historical numbers and extrapolate. And that‘s without taking into account that most progress is preventing death at a young age.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lack of purpose is the core thing I think. If you have that, then isolation solves itself, and obesity might very well solve itself too. Lack of purpose is also the consequence of not being able to even think of a brighter future. Not seeing what humanity COULD be and working towards it.
Lack of purpose is inevitable and unfixable. In the world where success is infinitely scalable as we are living in the information age, most people are doomed to uselessness no matter what. Trick is how to help them get over it. Obesity is a medical problem and will be solved by rather trivial medical means very soon, at least on that front, future is bright.
Citation needed. We're a loooooong way from post scarcity, as should be pretty obvious from the unemployment numbers.
> In the world where success is infinitely scalable as we are living in the information age
One of those things doesn't follow from the other.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#106Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If consumers don't purchase the products produced by the capitalist factories then the system would come to a standstill. thats interesting... so you are saying that it is capitalism itself presupposes that consumers exist, and without it you can't have capitalism...? it kind of makes one ask which came first...
I would argue capitalism arose with the invention of money, before that humans bartered. Consumption was the aim of the barter system also, so I would say consumerism came first ;)
This account of history of money is largely viewed as bunk by historians since there exist no evidence or description of a barter economy in our history.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#107Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Capitalism is just the producer I'm having difficulty parsing this part. What does this mean?
For me there are two parts at play: consumerism and capitalism, without one, neither the other. If consumers don't purchase the products produced by the capitalist factories then the system would come to a standstill. (I am thinking of the companies running/ordering from the factories not necessarily the factories themselves, i.e. Chinese factory.) This means that as a consumer, I can influence the system by not purc…
> If consumers don't purchase the products produced by the capitalist factories then the system would come to a standstill.
What about buying from a socialist factory? Is socialism also just the producer?
> This means that as a consumer, I can influence the system by not purchasing certain products. The larger consumer group, the larger the change.
This seems like you are talking about markets, not really capitalism.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nothing was robbed or destroyed - not sure why you adopt that defeatist attitude. The future could probably be all yours.
The anthropocene extinction, the insect apocalypse, ocean acidification, topsoil destruction, the pollution of 99% of wells and rivers.... Do I really need to go on? Yes, we were mugged. Yes, it was violent, and yes, we are bleeding. There is a fossil fuel and plastic industry rep right over there, with a smoking gun, saying we all need to do our part to recycle with a smirk on their face.
Re: Make the future bright again: On building a new philosophy of progress
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
The anthropocene extinction, the insect apocalypse, ocean acidification, topsoil destruction, the pollution of 99% of wells and rivers.... Do I really need to go on? Yes, we were mugged. Yes, it was violent, and yes, we are bleeding. There is a fossil fuel and plastic industry rep right over there, with a smoking gun, saying we all need to do our part to recycle with a smirk on their face.
if you believe in the world ending, sure.
The anthropocene extinction and the insect apocalypse aren't matters of belief.