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Dishwasher Salmon

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Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#361

Post by ashwagary »

wouldbecouldbe wrote: post #162
idk1 wrote: post #127

I feel like this page should have a warning, the fantastic Youtuber Ann Reardon investigated lots of cooking "hacks" to see if they were food safe, and she worked out that cooking salmon in a dishwasher does not bring it up to a food safe temperature. [1] Side note - in a different video she also did debunking on other food hacks and ended up investigating Russian bot networks who uploads both food hacks for hits and…

Salmon is often eaten raw.

>Salmon is often eaten raw.

Is cold smoked salmon considered raw or cooked?

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#363

Post by mattmaroon »

joecool1029 wrote: post #343
mattmaroon wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So has the raw salmon at the grocery store. You’d have a hard time buying fish that hasn’t been previously frozen, you just don’t know it because grocery stores thaw it before it goes into the display case.

I looked into this awhile back. While you're correct about previous freezing this is about mitigating microbe risk, not parasite destruction. The FDA has a specification that the fish must be frozen down to in order to ensure destruction of parasites. (I couldn't find a direct link to the FDA's guideline, here's one from MN that's the same: https://www.health.state.mn.us/communities/environment/food/... ) Ahi Tuna an…

I think any fish requiring such freezing likely would have been frozen to spec before it got to Costco or any restaurants. I’ve never asked any of the seafood purveyors I know about it, but I do know you can buy the stuff from them and use it immediately. I don’t trust the government for much but when it comes to being overly regulatory on food safety they’re pretty tough to beat. If it’s being sold ready to use I’m sure it was processed before, and there’s a HACCP plan in place to ensure it.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#364

Post by mattmaroon »

schwartzworld wrote: post #351
mattmaroon wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha. I don’t think it’s even true. I mean it wouldn’t surprise me if some sushi restaurant somewhere had such things, but restaurant supply companies don’t sell extra cold freezers. Seafood wholesalers might have such things but I’d wager the vast majority of sushi restaurants are using regular freezers.

Sushi in the us has to be held at -20C for 7 days, or -35C for 15 hours. They absolutely sell extra cold freezers that go to that temperature. Your home freezer won't. > I’d wager the vast majority of sushi restaurants are using regular freezers. After the 7 days at -20 the fish can just be transferred to a regular freezer. So you're right, most places probably don't have the special freezer in house.

No, it’s -4 for 7 days. Any commercial freezer gets that cold. Mine is a cheapo Avantco and goes to -8.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#365

Post by mattmaroon »

nunuvit wrote: post #358
mattmaroon wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with her conclusion. Raw salmon has no inherent pathogens of interest. People eat salmon raw at sushi bars. I’d be pretty unconcerned about the food safety issue. (Like any food there’s some risk of cross contamination, but that’s so rare.) As someone who has dealt with food safety (both as a hobbyist and professionally) a lot I can tell you most of what you read is based on government recommendations, whi…

Almost everyone misunderstands the recommendations. 165 F is only meant to be held for 1 second. To achieve the same level of pathogen reduction, you can trade temperature for time.

No, nobody misunderstands them. The recommendations leave out time entirely. People aren’t misunderstanding them, they’re just overly simplified. That’s why they’re bad. You are correct that you can do lower temperatures for longer, but FDA guidelines don’t mention this.

https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2011/05/25/cooking-meat-chec....

“The safe cooking temperature for all poultry products, including ground chicken and turkey, stays the same at 165 ºF.”

These are the same guidelines you encounter in the restaurant world, however in packaged food production you submit your recipes to process authorities who actually do consult time/temperature charts. But for restaurant and home guidelines they assume (not incorrectly) that it is basically impossible to ensure the restaurant or home chef cooked the chicken until the coolest part was at 145 for 2 minutes or whatever TF time/temp is needed to get the required salmonella reduction.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#366

Post by mattmaroon »

joecool1029 wrote: post #350
mattmaroon wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha. I don’t think it’s even true. I mean it wouldn’t surprise me if some sushi restaurant somewhere had such things, but restaurant supply companies don’t sell extra cold freezers. Seafood wholesalers might have such things but I’d wager the vast majority of sushi restaurants are using regular freezers.

Correct, however they do exist and some higher-end restaurants use them. Places usually advertise them as 'super freezers' that operate at -60C, some of the michelin star type restaurants go deeper with medical cryocoolers. It's becoming more common now that places like NYC have a regulation requiring freezing (where before a restaurant could just source from a parasite-free supplier).

Yeah I’m sure they exist and LeBernardin has them but they have to be extremely uncommon. The sushi restaurant industry just has to be reliant on that step taking place at the distributor level or even somewhere before.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#368

Post by KronisLV »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #239
KronisLV wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Up in Eastern Europe everyone is hardcore convinced overcooked meat is healthy because no bacteria plus warm food good for stomach. Tons of people still wince at medium rare steak. I probably fit into this group, because in my mind it's better to be safe than sorry. While most of the food you'd get in stores is going to have good quality control and should be safe, "most" is still not "all". I recall a story from a…

Seeing how poorly my folks handle hygiene in kitchen, they are more likely to get infection by washing your chicken or straight up leaving uncovered leftovers for days... If I offered you irradiated steak or tartare, would you eat it?

> If I offered you irradiated steak or tartare, would you eat it?

I'm not sure what radiation would practically do and whether eating something like that would be safe for me either way.

As for the steak, if I was sure that it was quality meat, I might opt for medium well due to social pressure, otherwise leaning more on the side of well done, which some might view as a social affront. As for tartare, I wouldn't eat it either way, the same way how I don't eat raw salmon or other raw meat like that - while there are people over here that do enjoy that sort of thing, it's a matter of taste or perhaps an acquired taste.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#369

Post by schwartzworld »

mattmaroon wrote: post #364
schwartzworld wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sushi in the us has to be held at -20C for 7 days, or -35C for 15 hours. They absolutely sell extra cold freezers that go to that temperature. Your home freezer won't. > I’d wager the vast majority of sushi restaurants are using regular freezers. After the 7 days at -20 the fish can just be transferred to a regular freezer. So you're right, most places probably don't have the special freezer in house.

No, it’s -4 for 7 days. Any commercial freezer gets that cold. Mine is a cheapo Avantco and goes to -8.

-4F is -20C.

Re: Dishwasher Salmon

#370

Post by daliusd »

xxs wrote: post #199
daliusd wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some eat raw meat but like drawing motorcycle without helmet it is not safe whatever standards you have

C'mon raw meat is one of the absolute best types of food. Beef tartare is great, although in most places I'd not have it home prepared, yet I'd trust most restaurants willing to put in a menu [or 'cooked' if asked directly in the kitchen]

I agree that it might be tasteful and I hope that's what you mean by "best", but health-wise there is nothing good about it.

https://sentientmedia.org/can-humans-eat-raw-meat/

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