Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

cnn.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 290 posts

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#151

Post by alex_sf »

jszymborski wrote: post #124
ethicalsmacker wrote: post #84

[flagged]

I'll never understand the "just words" takes I hear all the time. Everything you've ever said is "just words". Everything someone has said that has hurt you, that has caused fear in you, that evoked love and warmth has ever been " just words". How many of those words changed your life? The "I dos", the last words, the first words, the words said in a dark alley or the words said to you pushed up against a wall. Words…

The inability to self-regulate your emotions in response to what other people say is a behavior that you're supposed to outgrow sometime in middle school.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#152

Post by notch898a »

smt88 wrote: post #129
notch898a wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like being discriminated against in this case is roughly worth the same as having a limb cutoff according to one law firm. I don't want to be presumptuous and say that feeling discrimination on the job is better than having your arm cut off though, maybe it does feel worse. https://www.losangelespersonalinjurylawyers.co/average-case-...

Your own link gives lots of examples where compensation was much greater than $3M depending on the severity of the injury. $8,000,000 Verdict: The plaintiff lost three fingers and underwent numerous surgeries to save her hand. A conveyor belt was detected to have a defect and caught her hand in it, leading to extremely debilitating damages. $150,000 Verdict: While he was operating machinery in a school, the plaintiff…

Yes they give all those, right after they indicate an average of $3.2M for an arm. They give you averages first so you can see the figures posted later are some better case scenarios (well for comp anyway).

Note: not legal advice

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#153

Post by afiori »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #130
jeffparsons wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The McDonald's coffee incident is often cited as an example of litigation and punitive damages gone mad. Some woman got scalded by her coffee? And she was awarded how much? It's less often noted just how badly the woman was injured (third degree burns, significant amounts of skin seared off, etc.) and the details of why McDonald's was held liable (dangerous policy, not an isolated mistake). The details are worth a re…

I certainly agree that McDonald's got what it deserved, hope you don't think I was implying otherwise. on edit: actually I think the ability to sue for torts is one of the pluses of the American system, and is definitely better than a lot of other supposedly fairer countries.

McDonald got the verdict it deserved, but later appeals reduced the sum to a much lower value IIRC not even covering the total medical expenses + lawyers.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#154

Post by bryanrasmussen »

afiori wrote: post #153
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly agree that McDonald's got what it deserved, hope you don't think I was implying otherwise. on edit: actually I think the ability to sue for torts is one of the pluses of the American system, and is definitely better than a lot of other supposedly fairer countries.

McDonald got the verdict it deserved, but later appeals reduced the sum to a much lower value IIRC not even covering the total medical expenses + lawyers.

It was reduced but in the wikipedia article linked above https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v._McDonald%27s_Rest... it says

>The judge reduced punitive damages to $480,000, three times the compensatory amount, for a total of $640,000. The decision was appealed by both McDonald's and Liebeck in December 1994, but the parties settled out of court for an undisclosed amount.

I would think that the settlement out of court was less than 640000, because it was McDonalds that was appealing, thus for them to drop it they would have to pay less than what they were going to anyway (I suppose)

It also says >Liebeck died on August 5, 2004, at age 91. According to her daughter, "the burns and court proceedings (had taken) their toll" and in the years following the settlement Liebeck had "no quality of life". She said the settlement had paid for a live-in nurse.

So I think it was still significantly more than the 160,000 the suit was originally for in order to afford a nurse.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#155

Post by randyrand »

Erem wrote: post #118
ethicalsmacker wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is saying the behavior is acceptable. I'm thinking if I were a company, I'd be pretty keen on replacing humans with AI as soon as possible.

> I'm thinking if I were a company, I'd be pretty keen on replacing humans with AI as soon as possible. Which is to say little. That would be true whether discrimination law existed or not!

Of course. But the timeframe just gets moved up a lot when you have multi million unexpected costs for employing meat bags.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#156

Post by harvey9 »

diebeforei485 wrote: post #79

They didn't want to accept $15M from the original trial, they demanded a retrial and ended up with $3M. Should have taken the $15M. I'm not sure $3M leaves anything for the worker after legal costs.

Agree. 15m achieves two things: not a lot of money in Tesla terms but enough that it is noticed and would be a motivation to avoid similar claims. And enough after legal costs that the plaintiff never has to work there again.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#157

Post by tasuki »

diebeforei485 wrote: post #79

They didn't want to accept $15M from the original trial, they demanded a retrial and ended up with $3M. Should have taken the $15M. I'm not sure $3M leaves anything for the worker after legal costs.

I really wonder what was in their mind...

I wouldn't take the $15M if:

- I were very sure the eventual settlement would be much higher and relatively soon.

- I were very wealthy already and just wanted to make a statement.

- The legal costs would eat up vast majority of the $15M.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#158

Post by thaumasiotes »

oblio wrote: post #148
thaumasiotes wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if we don't defend the billionaires, they'll come after us commoners next. Funnily enough, that's exactly what happened under communism.

[flagged]

[flagged]

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#159

Post by amelius »

Animats wrote: post #68

It's amazing how big the settlements are for discrimination lawsuits vs. other labor law violations. Wage and hour violations get a slap on the wrist. Safety violations seldom cost a company more than a few thousand dollars unless someone is killed, and even then payments rarely exceed 5 figures.

It's modern slavery, but without the racism component.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#160

Post by thaumasiotes »

smt88 wrote: post #126
thaumasiotes wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Anyway, what's your point? I'm not Animats, but there might be a suggestion that being discriminated against is not actually worse than being killed.

> there might be a suggestion that being discriminated against is not actually worse than being killed He very specifically said unless someone is killed . The awards for deaths are absolutely astronomical. They have often reached into tens of millions all the way up to billions[1]. There's also a lot of historical precedent for racism leading to workplace deaths. 1. https://www.enjuris.com/blog/resources/biggest-wro…

> He very specifically said unless someone is killed.

And if you read... the rest of that very sentence... he notes that the penalty in such cases is effectively capped at $100,000. You quote him saying it. And then you rebut it by saying you can find penalties below $1,000,000, which isn't much of a rebuttal.

Post reply on HN