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Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

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Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#141
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Racism created so many problems in the US, including a devastating civil war with 2M casualties, that what seems like an over-reaction is understandable. It's the "nuke it from the orbit" option. Yes, nuking things from the orbit does have downsides, if you ask me. But if this imperfect tool is something that reliably prevents a new crop of Jim Crow laws, I can tolerate some fallout. (If you think that people are now…

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This is not exactly great, but not as terrible as sundown towns, segregation in schools and in transport, or denying the right to vote.

The US do have problems with large swaths of its Black population, and most of them are, to my mind, (self-)inflicted by segregation and oppression policies ranging from 1880s to 1950s.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never been awarded any money because somebody said something to me I didn't like. Yes words can have consequences. Let's take politics, some parties get elected based on their words, and then implement policies that are harmful to me. I still never got any kind of compensation for that kind of thing. How much money should ehticalsmacker be awarded from you, because you not thinking much of his comment hurt his f…

When you facetiously equate my comment with the harm perpetuated by someone actively racially discriminating against someone, do you expect me to take your argument in good faith? I'm not going to argue you with you.

Maybe not ”equate“. Let’s say it’s 10.000 times less harmful. 3M/10k = 300. You owe that man 300 bucks.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never been awarded any money because somebody said something to me I didn't like. Yes words can have consequences. Let's take politics, some parties get elected based on their words, and then implement policies that are harmful to me. I still never got any kind of compensation for that kind of thing. How much money should ehticalsmacker be awarded from you, because you not thinking much of his comment hurt his f…

When you facetiously equate my comment with the harm perpetuated by someone actively racially discriminating against someone, do you expect me to take your argument in good faith? I'm not going to argue you with you.

The only reason you think it's facetious is because you disagree with his specific point

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll never understand the "just words" takes I hear all the time. Everything you've ever said is "just words". Everything someone has said that has hurt you, that has caused fear in you, that evoked love and warmth has ever been " just words". How many of those words changed your life? The "I dos", the last words, the first words, the words said in a dark alley or the words said to you pushed up against a wall. Words…

I've never been awarded any money because somebody said something to me I didn't like. Yes words can have consequences. Let's take politics, some parties get elected based on their words, and then implement policies that are harmful to me. I still never got any kind of compensation for that kind of thing. How much money should ehticalsmacker be awarded from you, because you not thinking much of his comment hurt his f…

That's irrelevant. The HN comment forum is not government by equal opportunity employment law.

The definition of a hostile work environment is not "said something to me I didn't like". Quoting the EEOC at https://www.archives.gov/files/eeo/policy/facts-about-workpl... :

"... the anti-discrimination statutes are not a general civility code, Federal law does not prohibit simple teasing, off-hand comments, or isolated incidents that are not extremely serious. Rather, the conduct must be so objectively offensive as to alter the conditions of the individual’s employment."

The juries - in two different trials! - have determined that the conduct at Tesla meets that threshold.

Tesla is legally obligated to prevent workplace harassment, and respond to complaints about harassment. They did not do so. Punitive damages for Tesla's illegal behavior form the large part of the awarded amount.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#145
post #45

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People love to hate on Musk. What I find bizzare is that 15 years ago it was NickelBack and Justin Beiber. Nowaday it's Bezos/Musk. Not sure if I just don't live in the same circle since I'm twice as old or Tech Bros are the new pop stars.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#146
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you facetiously equate my comment with the harm perpetuated by someone actively racially discriminating against someone, do you expect me to take your argument in good faith? I'm not going to argue you with you.

Maybe not ”equate“. Let’s say it’s 10.000 times less harmful. 3M/10k = 300. You owe that man 300 bucks.

Your math doesn't work because the situations are incomparable.

jszymborski comments did not break the law.

Tesla violations of employment laws regarding a hostile work environment did break the law.

Two different juries decided that Tesla broke the law, and that punitive damages were needed to deter that behavior in the future.

What law is jszymborski breaking? What court is applicable? None.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#147
post #45

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People love to hate on Musk. What I find bizzare is that 15 years ago it was NickelBack and Justin Beiber. Nowaday it's Bezos/Musk. Not sure if I just don't live in the same circle since I'm twice as old or Tech Bros are the new pop stars.

It's the Reddit hive mind mentality.

Doesn't start entirely organic but it ends up being nearly 100% organic hate for certain topics.

Useful idiots start parroting hit campaigns and it becomes "common knowledge" for them which they repeat whenever the topic comes up, creating more useful idiots.

See any "controversial" topic here. Eich/Brave, Elon/Tesla, Facebook/React. It's all the same talking points, some being years old, most being purely emotional/subjective.

If you respond back they'll just call you a paid shill or troll, but if you don't respond back the echo chamber goes unchallenged and makes more useful idiots to parrot those same talking points to restart the cycle.

Funny you mention Nickleback, it was the first time I noticed the hive mind hate. Personally they are a really good band and everyone I know (outside of Reddit) likes them and knows pretty much every single one of their songs, wonder who Chad Kroeger pissed off.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#149
post #45

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It’s a cult of personality created by 10+ years of fawning press coverage.

Its kind of funny to claim 10+ years of fawning press coverage when the reality was that electric cars and by extension Musk go ridiculed and called dangerous and unsafe in the media. The same goes for every little issue with SpaceX.

Coverage of Musk has always been mixed and in main stream media often covered negatively.

Maybe in the more techy press it was mostly positive. But even then, go threw history here on HN. The idea that Tesla was scam and just about to go bankrupt was common wisdom and anybody who disagree got down-voted.

So the idea that positive press coverage is responsible is kind or ridiculous.

Its more like its the endless pro-vs-anti Musk wars that lead to this effect. And that happens in the media as it does on HN.

Re: Tesla ordered to pay more than $3M to former worker in racism suit

#150
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Racism created so many problems in the US, including a devastating civil war with 2M casualties, that what seems like an over-reaction is understandable. It's the "nuke it from the orbit" option. Yes, nuking things from the orbit does have downsides, if you ask me. But if this imperfect tool is something that reliably prevents a new crop of Jim Crow laws, I can tolerate some fallout. (If you think that people are now…

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Having been to Hawai'i a few times, and having seen how the native population, versus the settlers are doing, I must say, if being a settler in Hawai'i is what life under Jim Crow was, it must have all been rainbows and unicorns and sunshine.

It obviously wasn't, but it's always good to see someone point to the stipulations of an indigenous treaty, while closing both eyes to the context in which it was drafted[1]... Or to the broader context of systemic discrimination that is very actively pissing on people, to this very day.

[1] Reparations for specific, not theoretical damages inflicted on indigenous Hawai'ian people by the government of the United States. But good on you for finding a theoretical[2] loophole! Look, everyone, feast your eyes - Europeans were actually the real victims of discrimination in Hawai'i, circa 1920!

[2] Presumably, there's some European person, somewhere [3], that can prove that half of their family tree[4] traces back to direct decadency from a non-settler European who lived on Hawai'i prior to 1778, and would like to be a beneficiary of the treaty, but isn't actually protected by it!

[3] Somewhere next to a spherical cow, and other pedantic, but utterly theoretical oddities.

[4] Unless you mean to tell us that there was some self-sustaining, secret isolated enclave of Europeans that have lived on Hawai'i prior to 1788, that only intermarried between eachother, I would expect that after a century and a half of intermarriage with native Hawai'ians, nobody either in 1920, or today would ever be able to tell the difference between that 'European' and a native.

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