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Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

france24.com

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Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#371

Post by telmo »

apichat wrote: post #341
telmo wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Berlin and my main mode of transportation is the bike, since before e-scooters were a thing. Bikes are very popular here and I do not actually know a lot of people who live in the city and own a car. E-scooter made life objectively harder for cyclists. They are abandoned in the middle of bike lanes and create danger, or in the spots were you could park your bike safely. They make every walking street worse,…

Well you might not know enough people to make a statistic. The modal share of car in Berlin is 26%. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modal_share Please first reduce by 95% the amount of car, taxi and motorcycle and then we'll talk about scooter.

> The modal share of car in Berlin is 26%. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modal_share

Which is pretty low for a capital of a prosperous western country (order by that column and you will see). Maybe I do actually know enough people to make a statistic.

Would I like it to be even lower? Sure.

> Please first reduce by 95% the amount of car, taxi and motorcycle and then we'll talk about scooter.

We are taking steps to reduce cars here. Let us do that AND TALK ABOUT SCOOTERS. The citizens decide what is important to them. Thanks.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#372

Post by eloisant »

The vote wasn't very well known so only 8% of parisians voted.

In addition is was only open to the resident of Paris itself, all the people working in Paris but commuting from the suburbs couldn't vote.

Basically less than 200 000 people voted, for a city of 2 millions inhabitants and 7 millions if we include the commuters. And I'm not even talking about visitors.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#373

Post by crote »

vetinari wrote: post #292
soco wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's an answer to this, an answer which I see implemented in some places: cutting into the car lanes. Because you don't have to drive through the historical center.

In the cities, where nobody really lives in the historical center, it is doable. (We are not talking about driving through; we are talking about access/servicing; there are very few cities without a ring -- or several rings -- where driving through center is the fastest way from one end to another). In the cities, where real people live there, it is not. Every part of the city needs servicing, including center. Your…

You don't need space to have everyone's plumber visit at the same time using an 18-wheeler either. Just converting a few streets into one-way already frees up plenty of space.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#374

Post by mytailorisrich »

czechdeveloper wrote: post #273
seren wrote: post #246

Just a precision, (private) e-scooters are still allowed. The vote was on renewing or not the contracts of free floating solutions like Tier, Lime, etc

This is quite important. While e-scooters are very eco-friendly, in hands of large rending companies they usually have extremely limited lifespan and are not fullfulling this place.

> While e-scooters are very eco-friendly

Are they, though?

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#375

Post by M95D »

isaacremuant wrote: post #322

The whole argument about "they clog the streets" and annoy me is absolutely contrary to the actual incentives to cheaper and more ecological transport. It's a very NIMBY type of thinking. Hey, Citizen, if you don't have the means to buy, store and charge your own and occasionally would need one to deal with the craziness and unreliability of public transport, we are going to make it harder on you. Many countries in E…

I really don't understand why you blame the government. They (the people) VOTED! What did you expect gov't to do? Ignore the vote?

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#376

Post by _ph_ »

wtcactus wrote: post #196

Three main reason e-scooters and even bicycles take to the sidewalks, is that they are totally unsafe sharing the road with the cars, and that there's a lack of bicycle lanes. Once again, the absolute worst offender when it comes to safety inside towns - the car - gets spared from any responsibilities.

In all fairness, Paris seems to be the one big city which is strongly reducing cars and consequently creates room for bicycles.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#377

Post by zamnos »

dijit wrote: post #305
elric wrote: post #287

I wonder if there have been any social studies done regarding the apparent sense of entitlement that comes with operating any kind of vehicle. E-scooters are an absolute menace nearly everywhere I've seen them being used, with their operators weaving between pedestrians and cars alike, and littering the kerb when unused. But the same is often true for bicycles, especially the fast electric kind, and it's certainly tr…

It's also a problem of shared spaces. Pedestrians and Bikes are a poor mix. Bikes and Cars are a poor mix. but scooters and bikes seem to mix quite well. Malmo, Sweden; where I live, has excellent cycling infrastructure and the scooter "problem" is really miniscule. There are still issues, people parking in stupid ways or taking scooters into pedestrian areas, but overall there are significantly more dangerous driver…

What's interesting about the two photos on your blog is a lack of a lock. The scooters and bicycles where I am (SF) have a lock so they're locked to a bike rack while waiting, which prevents some classes of vandalizing. We had a problem with pedicab drivers dumping the scooters into the bay because of the competition they posed to their business. I think the photo requirement's largely solved the issue, along with the fact that people have adjusted to the change.

When the scooters first came on the scene there was a lot of gnashing of teeth, the strangest position were the vandals who would see a well parked scooter, kick it over, causing it to be across the sidewalk, and then go around complaining about the scooters being in the way. Anyway the furor has largely calmed down, who knows what exactly did it, but I suspect a large piece of it is simply people hating change and now they've come to accept it, and even use them sometimes.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#378

Post by dolmen »

elric wrote: post #287

I wonder if there have been any social studies done regarding the apparent sense of entitlement that comes with operating any kind of vehicle. E-scooters are an absolute menace nearly everywhere I've seen them being used, with their operators weaving between pedestrians and cars alike, and littering the kerb when unused. But the same is often true for bicycles, especially the fast electric kind, and it's certainly tr…

> I'm happy to accept the scooter menace if it means fewer cars on the road. And given how much of a nightmare traffic is in Paris, I'm surprised that Parisians don't seem to agree.

The Parisians were not asked about cars in this poll.

Parisians are less and less car owners as street parking space is being reduced and private parkings are costly.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#379

Post by cassepipe »

saiya-jin wrote: post #365
WJW wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well. You are legally allowed to drive a car around, but will still get stones thrown at your car if you do so in an ultra-orthodox neighborhood.

Even at random stranger cars (which I expect to be the case, you don't throw stones on cars of people you actually know, not under normal circumstances)? Ie I am a tourist and driving around and I like some older parts of town. What is it with people generally that make them feel above others, forcing their viewpoints on everybody else as the only truth? People should generally travel far and exotic more, it changes…

So if may summarize your question :

What is it with people who have an absolute definition of truth, people who think truth is something that has been revealed/given to them rather something to be found by questioning the world, people who think the world outside of their community is at best misguided if not evil, what is it with them that make them so intolerant ?

Who knows ?

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#380

Post by bluescrn »

simplotek wrote: post #347
bluescrn wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'E-scooters have safety risks, let's encourage people back into 2-ton fossil-fuel-burning cars instead!' If we want a future of EVs, we need to figure out how to include personal light EVs, not just very expensive full-size-car replacements for the wealthy.

> 'E-scooters have safety risks, let's encourage people back into 2-ton fossil-fuel-burning cars instead!' You somehow believe that the only options on the table for personal transport is either "2-ton fossil-fuel-burning cars" or the miraculous selfless service sold by a couple of multinationals. It must be hard to intentionally ignore all the public transportation services in all shapes and forms, like railway, bus…

Most scooter-haters don't differentiate between personally owned scooters and rental scooters, and personally-owned scooters (likely to be better maintained, more sensibly driven, and not abandoned in the street) will get caught up in the bans.
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