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Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

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Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#361

Post by seydor »

artificialLimbs wrote: post #354
nforgerit wrote: post #218

Gosh. Only about 10 years ago I used to be a convinced European from Germany. The last couple of years I started having my doubts that the EU will ever find its own legit style of handling tech concerns. Everything is crumbling and we still see deeply arrogant leadership seemingly trying to bs their way through the current turmoil. And what do they do? Regulate ChatGPT, try to introduce mass-surveillance through #cha…

>> I want competent leadership in politics and business that is able to set up a culture of innovation. I don't really want my government 'innovating' much at all. I want them to provide for defense of the people and freedoms. How many competent government leaders have you seen?

Would you be OK with an AI government that caters to those objectives?

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#362

Post by ronsor »

tfourb wrote: post #340
SanderNL wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Verifying by asking? .. I understand it's important, but I hate bureaucratic "solutions" that are technically correct but don't actually fix the issue.

There are standardized ways to check age based on national IDs and a company worth billions in venture capital like OpenAI can certainly afford to implement them. Alternatively they could just not publish a batshit crazy language model just because they see an opportunity to juice their valuation and spend a bit more time and money developing it so that it is reasonably safe to use for minors.

So you're saying OpenAI should collect more personal data?

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#363

Post by ReptileMan »

tfourb wrote: post #342
ReptileMan wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's called "That one more piece of Brussels crap that didn't solve the problem but makes people lives worse"

Not sure how "less ChatGPT" is making anyone's live worse but I guess that is a matter of opinion.

We are talking about the cookie warnings.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#364

Post by ur-whale »

vasco wrote: post #267
Aromasin wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About once a week I consider dropping out of the tech industry and becoming a politician just so I don't have to sit and watch by the sidelines as incompetent, ignorant people, who studied humanities with not a drop a technical aptitude, bullshit their way through funding and regulating technology. They are never well informed enough to come up with any sort or coherent solution, because they're barely capable in act…

"The technocratic illusion is that poverty results from a shortage of expertise, whereas poverty is really about a shortage of rights." William Easterly. I too wish they'd know more about what they decide on, but really they should already rely on subject matter experts and otherwise I don't think the problem is lack of knowledge, as the quote indicates. It was said in the context of erradicating poverty but I think…

> William Easterly.

Arguing from authority is nice and all (not), but the problem is not lack of technical expertise in decision makers (no one can reasonably expect a politician to understand modern AI tools), but rather about the decision making process itself.

There should be an established process by which such a dumb decision, with - in all likelihood - negative economic implications for the entire country, could be put to rest via a democratic process.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#365

Post by raverbashing »

Looks like people have have not read the complaint so the TL;DR : is

> The authority said the company lacks a legal basis justifying "the mass collection and storage of personal data ... to 'train' the algorithms" of ChatGPT.

> ChatGPT also suffered a data breach and exposed users conversations and payment information of its users last week,

> It added OpenAI does not verify the age of users and exposes "minors to absolutely unsuitable answers compared to the their degree of development and self-awareness."

That's it.

Apart from the age verification I don't see major issues (though it wouldn't justify an outright ban)

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#366

Post by KrugerDunnings »

stametseater wrote: post #344
nforgerit wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the beginning of GDPR I remember me sitting in annoying meetings with lawyers who essentially became Product Owners and designers while I still thought the GDPR-Framework makes sense in itself and might help in practice. But boy was I wrong. The people criticizing GDPR were right: Tech giants were able to cope better with the regulations while smaller domestic companies were put under an additional burden of exces…

The people on this site who criticize the GDPR don't even know what the GDPR does, including you. Cookie banners aren't from the GDPR, they're from the ePrivacy Directive as amended in 2009. I don't understand how you people even mix this up, the cookie banners appeared several years before the GDPR existed. It's like this site is a big pity party of surveillance capitalists whining into an echo chamber, remixing and…

I was complaining about the cookies banners in 2009, but ok people tend to conflate the two but it is not fair to lash out to people saying they don't like X with a simple rebuff that the thing is actually called Y. China makes the hardware, America writes the software and the EU makes the regulation, is a very common critique of technical people in the tech sector who lack political and economical power compared to the value they create.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#367

Post by piuantiderp »

nforgerit wrote: post #327
throwaway50601 wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the hell is there a list of crisp flavors at the EU? What if I want to make and sell my own original one?

I'd say that there's two different styles of legislation here. AFAIK in the US (and maybe UK too) a producer can put whatever they want into their products but can be sued to death in case sth goes wrong. Most EU countries have a different flavor such that they try to tightly control products and their ingredients upfront. Imho both styles have their pros and cons.

Food in Europe > USA. Even the fast food.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#368

Post by psychphysic »

simonh wrote: post #262
roomey wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this is a domestic regulator, making a domestic finding. This isn't an EU level decision. Countries in the EU have a lot of control over their own affairs, as they should. Conflating EU and Domestic policies is a bad thing (this was done a lot in the UK)

It was done massively in the UK, there were many cases of prominent criticism of "EU regulations" that we'd either actively championed, or were optional and chosen to adopt, or that we had actually oped out of anyway.

I only skimmed the article but we (UK) have our own nearly identical GDPR.

So Italy's concerns might also apply to us, and every EU nation with EU GDPR.

BUT let's not kid ourselves there is huge pressure to stop OpenAI from techphobes to pearl-clutching techphiles and of course ruthless rivals who want a breather to catchup.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#369

Post by hnuser847 »

SanderNL wrote: post #278
tablespoon wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have a unpopular opinion about this, but IMO it is the population that causes this. Vast swaths of Europe are rural especially in the south. Very, very averse to any kind of change. And vast swathes of technologists are insanely over -enthusiastic about technical change, to the point of it resembling a religion (and the singularitarians are like the monks who self-immolate themselves, except they want to immolate…

This is fair and I agree. GPT is way too fast. My point was more about stuff happening in timespans measured in decades that they still think is too fast.

Can you help me understand what exactly is so scary about ChatGPT? The only places where I see this hype/fear around ChatGPT is here on Hacker News. I've played around with it a bit and the magic wore off in less than 10 minutes. I asked it to generate code for a sudoku solver and the result it gave me was perfect. I then asked it to write code for a crossword puzzle generator and gave me a word search puzzle generator instead, where it simply shoved all the given words together at the bottom of the puzzle. These were just toy examples - I can't imagine ChatGPT is actually useful at work outside of generating very basic text snippits.

I asked a group 10 friends, none of who work in tech, about what they think about ChatGPT and then consensus is that it's a slightly better Google in certain situations. None of them are worried that it's going to put them out of work, take over the world, or violate their privacy. I have to agree with them. I think all this AI stuff is way overhyped, just like all the other fads that came before: VR, crypto, drone delivery, CRISPR, autonomous vehicles, metaverse, etc.

Re: Italian privacy regulator bans ChatGPT

#370

Post by illiarian »

ur-whale wrote: post #358
nforgerit wrote: post #218

Gosh. Only about 10 years ago I used to be a convinced European from Germany. The last couple of years I started having my doubts that the EU will ever find its own legit style of handling tech concerns. Everything is crumbling and we still see deeply arrogant leadership seemingly trying to bs their way through the current turmoil. And what do they do? Regulate ChatGPT, try to introduce mass-surveillance through #cha…

>Only about 10 years ago I used to be a convinced European from Germany. Hear, hear. How many "accept all cookies" button did you have to press today?

Please show me which part of GDPR mandates that banner.

As additional homework, you can also lookup malicious compliance etc. Or even the sibling discussion on how Facebook wants you to apply for a permission to opt out of their tracking: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35383925

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