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KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

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Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#131

Post by fortuna86 »

stuckinhell wrote: post #67
abecedarius wrote: post #57

Summary of near-14-minute video, since I certainly wished someone else had posted one to help me decide whether to watch: Says the KGB works mainly at ideological subversion of the enemy society, not James Bond stuff. This has 4 stages: - Demoralization. Slow, takes at least a generation to take hold or be reversed. U.S. is 3 generations in, graduates have positions of influence, and now it's mostly done by Americans…

It would certainly explain how "political correctness" a soviet concept made it into the american public consciousness far more than other nations of the world. Edited: Since I'm being downvoted. Political Correctness wasn't really a thing until around the 80's, the same time period as the cold war. It really is acommunist term. The term "political correctness" first appeared in Marxist–Leninist vocabulary following…

Soviet "political correctness" was about protecting the state from any criticism, American "political correctness" is about understanding systems of oppression from the standpoint of the oppressed.

Couldn't be more different.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#132

Post by fortuna86 »

abecedarius wrote: post #124
tokai wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The two PC terms are not related. In the start of the last century political correctness was about the correct adherence to ideology. The modern PC is a describer coined by us conservatives to label progressive political goals.

I guess I'll weigh in with my lived experience as a teenager at the time of the interview. I would've told you (maybe a few years later) "political correctness" in the U.S. started as an ironic term among lefty types with a sense of humor about their own milieu, which resonated more widely and got taken as ammunition and shortened to "PC" by more righty culture warriors. I think this was originally a kind of joke but…

> I would've told you (maybe a few years later) "political correctness" in the U.S. started as an ironic term among lefty types with a sense of humor about their own milieu, which resonated more widely and got taken as ammunition and shortened to "PC" by more righty culture warriors.

Similar to "woke". A term used with semi-seriousness, later coopted and weaponized by political opponents.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#133

Post by yostrovs »

somenameforme wrote: post #130
teachrdan wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US had many of the same expectations about victory in the second Iraq war.

And Ukraine... I've been unable to find any meaningful and direct quote from Russian military/political leaders stating they expected to immediately capture the city, but you can find plentiful US sources predicting exactly that: --- "The sources said that the initial US assessment from before the invasion – which anticipated that the Ukrainian capital would be overrun within one to four days of a Russian attack – re…

Putin didn't say it, but then he said he's not planning any invasion anyways. Here you can see various Russian tv personalities, we well as Lukasgenko, saying just that: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SuR7axsnUjw

And here is Sharij, a pro Russian journalist from Ukraine that's extremely popular, mocking all the reports of destruction of Russian forces on the first day and believing all the Russian lies, such as having destroyed all the anti aircraft systems of Ukraine: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7gO6vuI2-BQ

You must also understand that in Russian culture it was common to mock Ukrainians as dumb farmer hicks, while thinking of themselves as highly technologically advanced.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#134

Post by twixfel »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #100
twixfel wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By your logic, we shouldn't ever listen to any defectors, ever. That just doesn't make any sense.

That's like saying, "by your logic, we should never cross the road, because we can't possibly look both ways enough times!"

You're literally saying he shouldn't be listened to because he's a defector. You're not engaging with anything he said, just writing him off for being a defector. That is really stupid.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#135

Post by wil421 »

norwalkbear wrote: post #108
wil421 wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To say the American people were full of Marxism in the 80s and 90s is completely made up. I would say today is closer to what he was taking about than the 80s every were.

He says it takes three generations to reveal, so 80/90s being the start of subversion makes perfect sense.

He said the subversion was already planted in the 60s counter culture stuff and it was coming to fruition in the 80s.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#136

Post by dragonwriter »

dralley wrote: post #42

Modern Russian propaganda is not all that similar to anything the Soviet Union was interested in. There is no serious ideological backbone to it. It's all about putting out multitudes of conflicting narratives, giving people the "choice" to latch onto the ones they sympathize with most closely, and undermining the very concept of truth, democracy etc. "alternative facts", if you will. Timothy Snyder's description is…

> Modern Russian propaganda is not all that similar to anything the Soviet Union was interested in. There is no serious ideological backbone to it. It’s all about putting out multitudes of conflicting narratives, giving people the “choice” to latch onto the ones they sympathize with most closely, and undermining the very concept of truth, democracy etc. “alternative facts”, if you will.

The USSR had a core of ideological propaganda, but its geostrategic influence operations were more flexible than its core propaganda.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#137

Post by petre »

eptcyka wrote: post #70
ImHereToVote wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a quote of link to the "three days to Kyiv" comment from the Russian Federation?

Whilst I do not have a YouTube link, I do have seen several Russian pundits imply that Ukrainians would capitulate in 3 days, Russia just has to sneeze their way and they'd keel over, etc.

It's a common cliché. General Aleksandr Lebed claimed during Russia's 1991 intervention in Moldova that his tanks would be able to capture Bucharest in just 7 hours.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#138

Post by lostlogin »

somenameforme wrote: post #110
jabl wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "The Perestroika Deception"[1] in which he says that Perestroika is a strategic retreat because the Soviets know they are too far behind technologically to have any hope of defeating the west. They will however use that retreat to acquire modern technology and improve their economy so they can ultimately conquer the west. Such generations lasting grand conspiracies just sound too fanciful to take seriously. I think…

ICBMs can, at least in theory, be countered by effective anti-ballistic defense systems. The point of the 'tsunami nukes' is to sidestep that defense.

I think this thing of theirs is supposed to beat the current systems as Mach 10 is fast. It seems to be getting though in Ukraine but I am not an expert and Russia makes all sorts of claims. If it’s weapons work, it would be beating it’s smaller neighbour.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/russias-hypersonic-missile-stri...

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#139

Post by norwalkbear »

fortuna86 wrote: post #131
stuckinhell wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would certainly explain how "political correctness" a soviet concept made it into the american public consciousness far more than other nations of the world. Edited: Since I'm being downvoted. Political Correctness wasn't really a thing until around the 80's, the same time period as the cold war. It really is acommunist term. The term "political correctness" first appeared in Marxist–Leninist vocabulary following…

Soviet "political correctness" was about protecting the state from any criticism, American "political correctness" is about understanding systems of oppression from the standpoint of the oppressed. Couldn't be more different.

In 2023, disagree heavily. Political Correctness is a way prevent open conversation and debate. The Biden admin constantly reorients attacks on them as attacks on women or the LGBT community.

Political Correctness is used to shut down criticism of the modern American State. Wars are now pitched as femininist, see afghanistan.

Re: KGB Defector Yuri Bezmenov 1985 Interview – Idealogical Subversion

#140

Post by lostlogin »

somenameforme wrote: post #105
jemmyw wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

≥ Poseidon system[3] which is a 100mt radioactive tsunami fully autonomous doomsday weapon No where on that page does it say it is automated or carries 100mt. The only place it mentions tsunami is where it discredits the idea this weapon could cause one.

It says both of those things... - 100 megaton: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Status-6_Oceanic_Multipurpos... - automated: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Status-6_Oceanic_Multipurpos... The part about it somehow discrediting the idea that detonating a nuclear weapon under the ocean would cause a tsunami is why it's often a good idea to check sources, and not take Wikipedia at face value. From the source they cite:…

If the point is to kill people, a 20-50MT weapon killing just 15,000 people is a pretty dismal failure. The 16kT Hiroshima attack killed about 100,000.

We don’t need more inventive ways of killing people, we have plenty of options already.

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