Can I have a mode where some of that 128M is never flushed to RAM? For example, I'd quite like my disk encryption key to never end up in RAM - it's much harder to steal from inside a running CPU...
Isn't the TPM meant for precisely that use case?
AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
131–140 of 221 posts
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
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What driver is responsible for assigning specific games to specific CPU CCDs? Is this a real thing? Is it available on Linux? Or am I sticking with Intel?
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#133Have you noticed how AMD and Intel just do tiny steps, sometimes even not worth writing about when it comes to innovation? It's always either AMD matching the new Intel CPU of other way around - it's never about eg. completely crushing Intel. This is the problem of late stage capitalism, where both companies are owned by the same large investment funds and they use their power to ensure neither company could eat too…
I mean...it's not in anyone's best interests for the only two companies in a given market to completely crush the other, right? It would be bad for consumers (increase in prices), bad for B2B (increase in prices), bad for workers (wage suppression), bad for for the market (monopolies eventually focus more of their efforts on rent-seeking than what made them profitable in the first place).
That is only your assumption. How is Apple crushing the laptop market bad for the consumers?
Currently there is a paradox, that if you want to buy high quality and performant laptop and affordable laptop, Apple is very much the only option. No competition can come close. Sort of they got caught with their pants down as they stopped innovating just like AMD and Intel.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#134Have you noticed how AMD and Intel just do tiny steps, sometimes even not worth writing about when it comes to innovation? It's always either AMD matching the new Intel CPU of other way around - it's never about eg. completely crushing Intel. This is the problem of late stage capitalism, where both companies are owned by the same large investment funds and they use their power to ensure neither company could eat too…
No, it's the problem of cpu design being really fucking hard.
These two things are not mutually exclusive.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
So presumably a bug that can be fixed by either AMD updating their optimizer, Factorio updating to work better with it, or both?
If it's a problem for Factorio it's also a problem for others, so definitely something to fix on the AMD side.
Factorio is infamous for being radically memory bandwidth limited. Which yes is a problem others will have... but not many in gaming afaik.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#136Silly question: what constrains cache sizes? What prevents just making them bigger and bigger?
Die space. There's a maximum reticle size. You can't make chips bigger than that without using multi-chip techniques like wafer scale integration, chiplets and so on. If you do a full reticle chip and use most of it for memory you can get about 1GB of SRAM. But that would also be extremely expensive.
It's not quite as bad as you might think (though it is bad).
TSMC N5 is 0.021um per SRAM cell in high-density configuration (still going to be 5-10x faster switching than DRAM). That's about 47.62 bits/um. With 1,000,000 um2 per mm2. EUV reticle limit is 858mm2.
That amounts to 40,857,142,857 bits or about 4.756GB. That's almost exactly 250 dies per wafer. TSMC N5 wafers cost $17,000 or roughly $68 per chip (you can get very close to 100% yields on this kind of very basic chip). If we use part of the chip for internal controllers and interconnects, it would be about $70 per 2-4GB.
The highest-clocked DDR5 RAM I could find with minimal searching was $360 for 32GB.
The SRAM version would cost $560 at the cheapest for just the 32GB RAM not counting the RAM controller chips and all the packaging costs. With profits and everything included, your final price tag would likely be around $750 if you could produce in bulk and $1000 if you could not.
On the plus side, worrying about stuff like CAS latency would basically be a thing of the past with the bottleneck once again becoming the speed over the wire. Power consumption would also be lower without the need to constantly refresh. I doubt that anyone wants to pay that much money for disproportionally marginal increase in performance, but looking at all the people forking over thousands to scalpers for GPUs, maybe I'm wrong.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#137Can I have a mode where some of that 128M is never flushed to RAM? For example, I'd quite like my disk encryption key to never end up in RAM - it's much harder to steal from inside a running CPU...
Isn't the TPM meant for precisely that use case?
The TPM is good for storing keys, but can't actually decrypt/encrypt large amounts of data fast as required for disk encryption. So the key ends up temporarily stored in RAM.
The fact that most people leave their computers in sleep mode means that to a determined attacker, disk encryption is bypass able by reading the key from RAM.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
If it's a problem for Factorio it's also a problem for others, so definitely something to fix on the AMD side.
Factorio is infamous for being radically memory bandwidth limited. Which yes is a problem others will have... but not many in gaming afaik.
Given the primary selling point of these CPUs vs their non-X3D version is having more cache for memory access heavy workloads, if this is not a problem for your workload you're likely not in a position to gain much from the X3D variant anyway.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#139The inflation has really hit the consumer market... 700$ for CPU and over thousand for GPU... Memory is not cheap either... Not that it won't sell, but still these price points for something still called consumer start to be high. You could get a whole portable PC for same money.
Nope.
Ryzen 5 5600 6c/12t is 135eur.
i5 12400f 6c/12t is 155 eur.
You can get 8c/16c for a bit more, 5700x for 190eur.
Value DDR4 16/32gb kit and a reasonable basic mobo will give you an amazing system.
The only thing which still is kind of pricey is GPUs.
This 700eur cpu is the very upper end of consumer market.
5800x3D 8c/16c for 300eur is the most I would spend personally.
Re: AMD releases a new flagship CPU for consumer market with 128M of L3 Cache
#140Related and also interesting: Ryzen 7950X3D with One CCD Disabled - The 7800X3D Preview https://www.techpowerup.com/review/ryzen-7800x3d-performance...
The one caveat here is that actual 7800X3Ds might not be binned as well as the top end model, so I'd wait for real 7800X3D reviews if you're thinking about pre-ordering one based on this experiment.