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No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

who.int

171–180 of 385 posts

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#171
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment adds nothing to the discussion.

The world is full of people who strongly and honestly believe anecdotes are more important than statistics and statistics are meaninglessly astrological in nature. Its a very popular set of beliefs, majority in some areas.

> believe anecdotes are more important than statistics and statistics

Yes look at the current world, media, and western societies

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#172
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment adds nothing to the discussion.

The world is full of people who strongly and honestly believe anecdotes are more important than statistics and statistics are meaninglessly astrological in nature. Its a very popular set of beliefs, majority in some areas.

The next level up are people that have no actual understanding of statistics, empirical reasoning, and the weaknesses therein but have learned that if you throw certain science-y words together your arguments will tend land better.

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#173

I despise the WHO generally but this article is solid. There is too much confusion about alcohol in the medical industry. If you ask European doctors having a glass or two of wine "extends health". If you research typical government guidelines, they say a drink or two a day isn't bad or may even say it's "healthy" [1] The facts are facts. Alcohol is a poison that wrecks havoc on your mind and body. If having one drin…

this article is doing an even worse job though: there are a lot of people i the comments that are convinced that if they do not drink at all, they will live longer.

They won't.

> The facts are facts. Alcohol is a poison that wrecks havoc on your mind and body

So are almonds

If you eat 20 apples including the seeds, you die instantly.

But so are also soda beverages

but US citizens drink an estimated 154 liters per capita every year

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Risks start from the first drop" If this is true, the medical community is actively causing harm. Many compounded or suspended children's medicines contain alcohol. Many do not have alcohol free alternatives.

Even if there are risks you have to compare the risks. Would I have a child drink a small amount of alcohol for some life saving drug? Just like how you drive to work despite there being a risk in driving.

So what is the risk of damaging your life from 4 drinks a week compared to risks of getting killed by someone else walking to work every day (in the US with its drivers and SUVs)? Less alcohol is better, perhaps, but we live past our savings while drinking all the same.

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#177
1) The word 'health' should not be used because that's just a buzzword. The right word in this context could tentatively be 'lifespan', meaning that they are tentatively projecting that in the big sample of humans they surveyed those who drink 0mL of alcohol will stick around for longer compared to those who drink even 1mL. Meaning that in their model there is a correlation between the 2 data of sticking around for longer and alcohol intake.

2) Not even lifespan could be the right word because there are all sorts of stuff that alcohol facilitates which prolong lifespan by decreasing stress and anxiety, which in turn lower cortisol which is just as bad for lifespan when considered vis-a-vis alcohol.

As always the so called authorities spend too much time in the lab and are essentially monodimensional individuals who (no pun intended) fail to see the bigger picture.

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#178
> To identify a “safe” level of alcohol consumption, valid scientific evidence would need to demonstrate that at and below a certain level, there is no risk of illness or injury associated with alcohol consumption.

The premise of this “no level of consumption is safe” is this requirement to prove 0 risk.

If for instance drinking one glass everyday increases your cancer chances by 0.0000000001%, bringing it to 0. 0000300001%, it would still be considered unsafe, as your chances of cancer increased.

I see the logic, but that isn’t layman‘s categorization of safe or unsafe. And what are the actual base risk of cancer for a healthy individual ?

Taking a base of 60 million death per year, who’s numbers on cancer are of 10 million [0], where death by liver cancer are 830 000, roughly 1%. Given that those don’t all come from alcohol, and to reach that stage requires way more than standard consumption, the base risk feels already pretty low.

All in all, while this article is factual, it turns this facts in such a biased way it feels dogmatic at times. If we’re going to have serious discussions around alcohol, we shouldn’t start them like this.

[0] https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/cancer

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#179

I despise the WHO generally but this article is solid. There is too much confusion about alcohol in the medical industry. If you ask European doctors having a glass or two of wine "extends health". If you research typical government guidelines, they say a drink or two a day isn't bad or may even say it's "healthy" [1] The facts are facts. Alcohol is a poison that wrecks havoc on your mind and body. If having one drin…

On the subject of decompressing from daily stress.. I would humbly submit that a small (just above psychoactive threshold) puff of vaporized (not combusted) THC extract or other legal cannabinoid, is a good harm reduction measure, compared to alcohol. Especially if it eliminates the urge to drink or seek other more risky hedonic outlets.

Re: No level of alcohol consumption is safe for our health

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the challenge is really that even spices like pepper cause inflammation. You can always find a downside to anything you ingest. I think you’re correct, the best approach is to explain “safe limits”. Personally, I think it’s fine if people smoke, drink, etc until their heart is content. That said; it’s also why I’m opposed to socialized medicine. Almost everyone I know on social medicine didn’t take care of th…

> The challenge with socialized medicine is that we should now push to ban alcohol, logically. That has not worked in the past. Do you think it would work any better nowadays?

It actually has worked in the past. But a more pragmatic approach is to tax alcohol heavily so that it costs you more to willingly destroy your body.
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