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As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

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Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#681

Post by the6threplicant »

ilyt wrote: post #670
vbezhenar wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate on that? As I see it. Let's say that human civilization does not turn Earth to a nuclear wasteland but rather resolves its social issues and proceeds with colonization of Solar System. We already sent probe out of our Solar System. It does not look for me to be impossible technology to build a probe with AI and robots smart enough to reach another star system, decelerate there, build some factories…

> Eventually probe will find planet with life. May be life is more abundant than we imagine now. May be not. Surely there will be protocols for the probe to investigate life. It's hard to imagine what those protocols would be. May be explore freely until certain technology advances are observed and then hide. So may be our ancestors saw alien probes on a regular basis and just didn't care. But now those probes observ…

The people that believe that these UAP seem to think there is both a Fermi paradox and reverse Fermi Paradox at the same time.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#682

Post by neuronic »

simonh wrote: post #626
runjake wrote: post #8

I worked on stealth aircraft that would occasionally cause civilian UFO reports. It was common for the reports to mention that these UFOs maneuvered unlike any man-made aircraft, which was always a good chuckle because they were usually just flying straight or banking normally. However when seasoned military pilots like Fravor speak on the matter, I listen. When a bunch of them speak about the same incident, I take t…

The now debunked sensor recordings were also reported by seasoned military pilots. You can even hear them discussing their observations on some of the recordings. In one of them they are patently misreading the sensor data displayed in the video. I’m sorry, but if that doesn’t thoroughly and permanently discredit this line of reasoning, I don’t know what will.

As long as there are mysterious 1990s era X-Files/Control like stories to be generated for clicks and attention, nothing will. Why are these stories being released primarily on clickbaity media like The Hill, CNN or Fox News? The "whistleblowers" could just open up to related non-profits, respected security blogs or other outlets which aren't driven to squeeze out every possible ad and sponsorship dollar.

In the end, there is zero accountability or consequences for these kinds of articles and the sparse "unclassified" information is fuzzy enough to inject all kinds of speculation. This is not to dismiss the topic as a whole, it's the framing that I find weird.

I am not leaning in either direction at all. Optical phenomena, sensor artifacts, weather, foreign or compartmentalized tech, or aliens... The point is not to be contrarian - it's important to keep an open mind until proven otherwise. However, this heavy X-Files like framing of mysterious otherworldy tech roaming around military facilities is somewhat over-the-top and doesn't really seem to (!) serve the case.

Also, there are probably also projects that are compartmentalized to a degree where part of the military does not know about other parts of the military doing/building/researching specific stuff. What better way to test your capabilities than exposing them to real world scenarios against the arguably most advanced defense systems on the planet?

The information is just too sparse to reach any meaningful conclusion so it's ideal clickbait media material, even if the topic itself is serious and important.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#683

Post by namaria »

rowanG077 wrote: post #654
namaria wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Building a particle accelerator is not the same as adding 1% to the cost of an already costly machine for the off chance of proving some marginal phenomena visually.

Considering this goes up to congress and they think it might be a national security threat I don't think it's bad idea. It's also pretty doubtful this will even increase the cost by 1%.

Sure. Random internet forum person demands better evidence to be convinced, when a) we don't even have all data; b) no-one cares what random internet forum person thinks. We are watching from the sidelines jeering for irrelevant changes.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#684

Post by the6threplicant »

snickerbockers wrote: post #145

There's a real problem with people being close-minded towards anything that seems fantastical. This includes scientists and other professionals who ought to know better. Obviously it's unscientific to jump to conclusions and assume that anything that doesn't make sense must be aliens or magic or whatever but at the same time, it's also unscientific to ignore physical observations just because they seem like something…

What do you want people to do.

I see lot of "close minded" people looking at the evidence and concluding that it's not enough evidence to conclude aliens are visiting us.

It looks like these UAPs are everywhere but the evidence is so low level that I wouldn't even conclude they aren't just planes or ducks instead.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#685

Post by anon7725 »

wpietri wrote: post #515
danenania wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think aliens and magic belong in the same category though. Magic/supernatural by definition is contrary to physical laws and scientific understanding. But the existence of aliens would in no way contradict any physical laws or scientific consensus. It would be a shock, obviously, just like it was a shock when we discovered that other galaxies exist, or black holes, or that nuclear fission is possible. If inte…

>But the existence of aliens would in no way contradict any physical laws or scientific consensus. The existence of aliens, sure. But the presence of aliens on Earth pretty much does. There's no reason to think FTL travel is possible, and it's economically unreasonable to think some species is going to invest in generation ships to cross the great interstellar gulfs just so that they can fuck around with pilots and a…

> There's no reason to think FTL travel is possible

This seems like fairly closed thinking. We’ve observed strange behavior at the quantum level. We have plausible theories of wormholes and multiverses. It’s conceivable that some civilization has assembled FTL travel from these and other natural phenomena yet unknown.

> it's economically unreasonable to think some species is going to invest in generation ships

We’re working on AI and we can sequence DNA. A sufficiently advanced civilization could send a ship that can synthesize its crew upon arrival.

We have observed quantum entanglement. Perhaps information can travel faster than light and all you need to send physically is the equivalent of a quantum modem attached to a Star Trek replicator.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#686

Post by godelski »

literalAardvark wrote: post #675
godelski wrote: post #662

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Our understanding of physics has been broken for 100% of humanity's history. I'll let Asimov speak on this because he says it better than I can. But this is not even remotely accurate. We've become less wrong over time. https://hermiene.net/essays-trans/relativity_of_wrong.html

Thanks, I'll read it. I was quite precise in my wording and didn't say what you are responding to. My opinion (and it's just that, I'm unprepared to defend it) is that we've always been [less and less] wrong on everything. And since we can't know what the boundaries of knowledge are, and it could easily be some insane unbounded fractal existence, it seems rash to me to decide that we know enough to say that there can…

Problem is that this technology breaks our understanding of causality. So it isn't a "less wrong" type of situation so much as we have to rewrite everything. Specifically it means things that happen in the future can affect things in the past (communication past the light cone). The discoveries of quantum and relativity didn't break classical mechanics so much as extend it. But to rewrite how a sequence of events happens, well that's a big fundamental change. The light from my flashlight turning on at t=1 does not force me to press the button to turn it on at t=0.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#687

Post by godelski »

vbezhenar wrote: post #673
xavxav wrote: post #657

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We already sent probe out of our Solar System. To give an idea of the scale involved, Voyager 1 is only 0.058% of the way to the nearest star system, and that took 45 years. Granted it wasn't built for speed but given that the best hypothetical plans for a spaceship we have allow travel at ~.1c it'll take 50 years not counting acceleration / deceleration. > Eventually probe will find planet with life. May be life i…

> Even assuming that some set of automated probes have been travelling our galaxy for millions of years, and reached earth in the last few thousand years, where are they now? By what mechanism could they even be hiding? Every inch of the planet is being watched by satellites. The most obvious way to hide is stay small. I don't know what physical limits would be to build small robots with advanced technology. Build ma…

Okay, so they are small and the objects being discussed in this thread aren't those. (there's a lot of complications that come with being small btw, but maybe another user will go into that)

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#688

Post by isthisthingon99 »

jbm wrote: post #10
isthisthingon99 wrote: post #5

[flagged]

That is a nearly 2 hour video without any links or any details, with the top comment being from someone with the name "woke world order". Can you please offer some synopsis beyond the video title?

[dead]

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#689

Post by ak_111 »

bostonwalker wrote: post #548

Excluding otherworldly forms of speculation about why possible aliens are visiting us, this subject really boils down to four tangible questions about how we arrived at this footage and the eyewitness accounts from Fravor et al: - Is it aliens? - If not, do these sightings represent real unexplainable technological phenomena (advanced propulsion technology)? - If not, are the eyewitness accounts credible? - In any ca…

I am surprised you haven't proposed the most likely (and sadly boring) for me:

7) They are not aliens or any unexplainable phenomenon, witnesses are all deluded or victims of things like lens glare and the DoD has let them go public (importantly without stigmatising them) to:

  a) Encourage others serving at the frontline to come forward when they see UFO in case it is foreign adversarial tech (such as the spy balloon) without worrying of being stigmatised

  b) satisfy public demand by being as transparent as possible with the situation to prevent further delusion and conspiracy theories in the public.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#690

Post by [deleted] »

kapral18 wrote: post #636
reso wrote: post #596

Mick West's breakdowns of the Pentagon UAP videos was the nail in the coffin of this era of UFO hype for me. https://youtu.be/Le7Fqbsrrm8?t=665 These were supposed to be the smoking gun evidence. UFO believers inside the DoD and as high up as US Senators fought for years to get them declassified. As soon as they were public, they were all quickly identified as sensor glare, bokeh, or mis-understood perspective. More…

Check out the debunk of the debunk :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBt4CNHyAck

[deleted]
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