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Iran abolishes morality police

hindustantimes.com

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Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#151

Post by busterarm »

throwaway0asd wrote: post #112
hairofadog wrote: post #91

It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator so they could avoid paying oil fees. The 1979 Iranian revolution was the pendulum swinging back hard the other way. I’m in no way supporting Iran’s religious extremism or current government, but they are monsters that we created. The coup: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'%C3%…

It is also worth noting the Iranian supreme leaders (there have only been two) are not Ayatollahs. I see these terms falsely conjoined many times in the comments here. Comparatively the Ayatollahs, or specifically the Grand Ayatollahs, are quite moderate compared to the fundamentalists In political power. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Khamenei https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayatollah The most well known of the…

> It is also worth noting the Iranian supreme leaders (there have only been two) are not Ayatollahs. I see these terms falsely conjoined many times in the comments here. Comparatively the Ayatollahs, or specifically the Grand Ayatollahs, are quite moderate compared to the fundamentalists In political power. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Khamenei

Yeah..."Mr Death To America" Himself is a moderate... I see why you used a throwaway.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#152

Post by biztos »

throwaway0asd wrote: post #112
hairofadog wrote: post #91

It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator so they could avoid paying oil fees. The 1979 Iranian revolution was the pendulum swinging back hard the other way. I’m in no way supporting Iran’s religious extremism or current government, but they are monsters that we created. The coup: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'%C3%…

It is also worth noting the Iranian supreme leaders (there have only been two) are not Ayatollahs. I see these terms falsely conjoined many times in the comments here. Comparatively the Ayatollahs, or specifically the Grand Ayatollahs, are quite moderate compared to the fundamentalists In political power. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Khamenei https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayatollah The most well known of the…

I was surprised to hear this, since Khomeini was so commonly referred to as "Ayatollah" in the media. Wikipedia[0] still says his title was "Grand Ayatollah," but what appears to be his official memorial web site[1] calls him "Imam Khomeini."

(Unrelated, but interesting to consider he was only in power for about 10 years, and has been dead for more than 30.)

[0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruhollah_Khomeini

[1]: http://en.imam-khomeini.ir/en/n3733/Imam/Who_is_Imam_khomein...

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#153

Post by refurb »

hairofadog wrote: post #91

It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator so they could avoid paying oil fees. The 1979 Iranian revolution was the pendulum swinging back hard the other way. I’m in no way supporting Iran’s religious extremism or current government, but they are monsters that we created. The coup: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'%C3%…

The US didn’t install a corrupt dictator. It basically backed groups who were looking to overthrow Mossaddegh, who himself was fighting to stop from being ousted by the Shah (who held that power legitimately).

There were already riots in the streets over his rule. He was going to be ousted CIA involvement or not.

Plus it’s a bit odd to blame the US for a ruling body who ousted the US backed one.

That’s like blaming the US for the Vietnamese Communist party today.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#154

Post by kasey_junk »

cies wrote: post #141
whateveracct wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The United States' elections are simply not at the same level as Iran's (if that is what this comment is implying)

Different sure, but different in its resistance to reform? Nah.

There is a huge difference. The US has a stated procedure on how to reform the election process. It’s outlined in the constitution and has been invoked several times in the history of the republic.

The idea that all flawed systems are equally flawed is a really weak argument and one that is used by oppressive forces to further their purposes.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#155

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

msrenee wrote: post #129
Eisenstein wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but they are monsters that we created. I think we should be careful using wording like that. The Iranians have agency and can do things on their own. Just because the west meddled in things doesn't give us the right to claim the results as ours, be they good or bad.

Well, we took their agency away and removed a government that at least wasn't outright killing women for wearing pants. This is also a great way to produce extremists, which then moved into the power vacuum created by throwing their governing system into chaos. We've done it a number of times in South America as well. I'd say there's enough data points to believe that we punted them into the downwards spiral that the…

Is it fair to characterize the 1979 revolution as extremist without qualification? We find it extreme by our own standards, but by most accounts Khomeini was very popular in Iran.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#156

Post by morby »

bnralt wrote: post #117
hairofadog wrote: post #91

It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator so they could avoid paying oil fees. The 1979 Iranian revolution was the pendulum swinging back hard the other way. I’m in no way supporting Iran’s religious extremism or current government, but they are monsters that we created. The coup: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'%C3%…

> It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator This simply wasn't the case. I discuss this in a post below, but by the time Mossadegh was removed he had used a fraudulent plebiscite (claimed a 99.94% victory) to dissolve the parliament he had been feuding with and rule entirely by fiat. The Shah also wasn't installed by the U.S., he had…

This is a very white washed outlook on what happened. Would love to give a good reply when I have time. Suffice to say, this poster makes it seem like the US and UK were helpless and just stood by as things evolved in Iran. This is utterly insane.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#157

Post by lajosbacs »

Matl wrote: post #132
lajosbacs wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 'West' might support the protesters, sure, but the effort is still negligible to the will of Iranians. What I read in your comment is that the ppl of Iran have no agency, all is just conflict between the 'West' and whatever. I just find this stance incredibly patronising. One hears the same thing on Ukraine (from Chomsky, for example).

> What I read in your comment is that the ppl of Iran have no agency My stance is the exact opposite, it's that they do have agency but that the constant articles in the West celebrating a chance for some sort of regime change actually gives the Iranian government the ammunition it needs to make them appear sponsored/non-organic. It makes it worse that the West does in fact have a history of regime change in Iran, (t…

Ok, I see and accept your point.

But still after your clarification, I see nothing wrong with west cheering the revolution. a) It is our side b) It is impossible to enforce 'not cheering', one slip is enough to be used against you, see Musk and Russian propaganda.

And regarding the Gulf states, I also do not like this. But one has to pick his battles and better (for us) getting our oil from them than from Russia.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#158

Post by pchangr »

Eisenstein wrote: post #122
hairofadog wrote: post #91

It’s worth noting that Iran was a democracy until the 1953, when the US and UK supported a coup to install a corrupt dictator so they could avoid paying oil fees. The 1979 Iranian revolution was the pendulum swinging back hard the other way. I’m in no way supporting Iran’s religious extremism or current government, but they are monsters that we created. The coup: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'%C3%…

> but they are monsters that we created. I think we should be careful using wording like that. The Iranians have agency and can do things on their own. Just because the west meddled in things doesn't give us the right to claim the results as ours, be they good or bad.

As a third world national whose country was immersed in a 35 year old civil war purposefully created by the CIA.. I find it incredibly difficult to restrain myself. I would really suggest you to research a little bit more about your own history. It’s really hurtful to read this.

Re: Iran abolishes morality police

#159

Post by dontbenebby »

r721 wrote: post #142
dontbenebby wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not on Twitter, probably because I blocked Elon.

Thread reader version: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1599344163769978880.html

Thanks, I hate how Internet Archive requires Javascript, I browse on this nym in Tor to avoid malware and avoid crossing the streams^H^H^H^H^H^H^H circuits.
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