Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought • Hacker News Board

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#511

Post by moonchrome » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:28 PM UTC

mschuster91 wrote: post #467

rconti wrote: post #449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems fairly natural that a couple in most societies (current and historical) would be better able to provide for their children the older they are. The main exception I can think is family support; having younger grandparents and great grandparents could be an advantage, I guess? I'm not sure I'd look at a society where people have lots of children so they can put them to work and say "yeah, this is the way socie…

> It seems fairly natural that a couple in most societies (current and historical) would be better able to provide for their children the older they are. When I was born in 1991 and my sister in 1995, a simple police officer and a nurse in half-time could provide for two children with ease, in one of what was even back then one of the most expensive cities in Germany. Today, me (IT worker) and my s/o (public health a…

I was under the impression that programming and IT is very undervalued in Germany, like you're basically earning slightly above average in most cases. At least that's what I gather from two friends who live there.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#512

Post by Eleison23 » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:29 PM UTC

xienze wrote: post #267

PakG1 wrote: post #156

My wife and I have a beautiful daughter about to turn 2. But she wouldn't have existed if it weren't for IVF (in vitro fertilization). Had to stab her stomach with needles for a while to make hormones to mass produce eggs and then they took my sperm to put into her eggs and see which ones took. Five viable pairings happened. Three were put into her and out came the one kid. Other two are in cryo for future use, and h…

> and my wife was 38 at the time of conception. This sounds obvious, but apparently isn’t to a lot of younger people. 38 is considered quite old to start having children (yes it happens, but it’s called a “geriatric pregnancy” for a reason), and I’m sure it contributed to the difficulties conceiving. A lot of young folks have been convinced that child birth can be put off more or less indefinitely while you pursue a…

No post body was provided.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

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Post by WarOnPrivacy » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:29 PM UTC

duffyjp wrote: post #474

Aeolun wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you imagine having two generations of kids at 20 years old? ‘Grandma’ will be 40 when she has her first grandkid.

I'm 41 and my boys are 4 and 8. It's wild to even consider I could have been a grandfather by now if my life choices had been different. Wouldn't be such a bad thing though, at 40 you're still pretty young so I could've had my freedom back by now. As it is I'll be 55 by the time they're out of the house and probably won't be able to pick mountain biking back up... And then if they wait a while I could be pushing 70 b…

> Great-grandkids might be a relic of a time gone by

They seem to be the case for me. My five are 20-30. I see no avenue for grandkids where it takes 3-4 incomes to afford minimal living expenses.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#514

Post by Knufen » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:30 PM UTC

ipdashc wrote: post #505

Knufen wrote: post #478

I did my Master Degree in Organic Chemistry where we tried to develop a male contraceptive pill. I spend a lot of time studying sperm so here is a short list of thing to avoid regarding sperm quality (not ranked): 1. Eating and drinking from plastics (This includes aluminum cans which are plastic lined) [a] 2. Heating food in ANY type of plastic [a] 3. Caffein intake [b] 4. Sugar intake [c] 5. NOT exercising regularl…

I think I'm missing something. On the Results in study [b], they say > Semen parameters did not seem affected by caffeine intake, at least caffeine from coffee, tea and cocoa drinks, in most studies. Conversely, other contributions suggested a negative effect of cola-containing beverages and caffeine-containing soft drinks on semen volume, count and concentration. If tea and coffee don't cause an effect, but cola and…

There is an ongoing discussion on the effect of caffein on sperm quality. There are articles which describes a possible route for DNA damage to the sperm from caffein https://www.cureus.com/articles/109365-effect-of-stress-and-.... From personal (lab) experience there is a clear difference to the smell of sperm from a coffee to a non coffee drinker, so it ends up there somehow. Whether it truly has an effect is still being discussed.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#515

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:30 PM UTC

patja wrote: post #487

Aeolun wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you imagine having two generations of kids at 20 years old? ‘Grandma’ will be 40 when she has her first grandkid.

I find it surprising that this is something that has to be imagined. I run into real world examples of this all the time. It isn't the norm, but it sure isn't something that requires imagination to see all around us.

[deleted]

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#516

Post by moonchrome » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:30 PM UTC

zug_zug wrote: post #151

So this trend has been going on for a while now, I looked a bit into it about 5 years ago here's what I found: - Tons of popular and legal products/chemicals are "endocrine disruptors"[1] (fancy term for mess with hormones). - The FDA/EPA doesn't deny that, they don't themselves even really require tests for long-term health effects in humans (too difficult). Instead they give animals a 1000x+ dose and look for immed…

This appears to be a global trend.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#517

Post by danuker » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:33 PM UTC

dj_mc_merlin wrote: post #510

Knufen wrote: post #478

I did my Master Degree in Organic Chemistry where we tried to develop a male contraceptive pill. I spend a lot of time studying sperm so here is a short list of thing to avoid regarding sperm quality (not ranked): 1. Eating and drinking from plastics (This includes aluminum cans which are plastic lined) [a] 2. Heating food in ANY type of plastic [a] 3. Caffein intake [b] 4. Sugar intake [c] 5. NOT exercising regularl…

I might as well stop using condoms.

I suppose it's a good idea, if you're trying to conceive :)

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#518

Post by strix_varius » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:33 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #22

compiskey wrote: post #12

But are they? https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/05/fears-over-fa...

> In addition, they argued that the design of the 2017 study relied on racist and colonial hierarchies and assumptions This response sounds like real science for sure.

> “By proposing an alternative approach to sperm count data, we aim to contribute to the burgeoning discussion among reproductive health scientists and other researchers and clinicians about men’s health,” said Boulicault, lead author of the paper and a doctoral candidate in the Department of Philosophy and Linguistics at MIT

A Philosophy & Linguistics PhD - just who you should trust to analyze medical results!

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#519

Post by skorpeon87 » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:33 PM UTC

waboremo wrote: post #480

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have a societal problem when the rational individual choice (to provide your children the best head start) is to wait until your fertility declines to have children.

While true, the desire to push everyone into heavy productivity mode from ages 18-55 are a societal problem, there is also a financial (and educational) problem where solutions to combat the aging fertility problem are often locked behind procedures that cost more than a year's salary for majority of people. An example of this is that freezing your eggs costs upwards of $30k, and is still viewed as something only ver…

Even if you make egg freezing cheap, it will still have an abysmal success rate (particularly if a woman waits until her 30s to have the eggs freezed), and should rationally be viewed as a hail Mary of last resort. This should not be viewed as the default rational path towards pregnancy, even if it were free. A society which is structured to encourage this path is setting people up for serious disappointment.

Re: Sperm counts worldwide are plummeting faster than we thought

#520

Post by creaturemachine » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 5:34 PM UTC

rconti wrote: post #449

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have a societal problem when the rational individual choice (to provide your children the best head start) is to wait until your fertility declines to have children.

It seems fairly natural that a couple in most societies (current and historical) would be better able to provide for their children the older they are. The main exception I can think is family support; having younger grandparents and great grandparents could be an advantage, I guess? I'm not sure I'd look at a society where people have lots of children so they can put them to work and say "yeah, this is the way socie…

Monetarily maybe, but not physically. I'm 42 with a 5-year-old and man do I wish I was doing this in my 30's.