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Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

economist.com

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Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#351

Post by prvit »

rdtwo wrote: post #344
prvit wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If you ran a store that repeatedly sold stolen goods do you think local police and prosecutors would ignore you? Yes, if you operated your business in a way similar to Amazon the cops and prosecutors would in fact almost certainly ignore you.

Yeah no they wouldn’t. How long did Amazon collect no sales tax before that loophole closed? How much did they have to pay back? If you tried that the state would stream roll you

Are you kidding? The “sales tax loophole” just supports my point, if it was just smaller businesses they would’ve gone on forever.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#352

Post by balls187 »

nostromo wrote: post #124
fragmede wrote: post #53

I've lived in the same city now (not NYC) for 10+ years, so I'm moderately connected with all sorts of people and not just a bubble of affluent tech people. So I'll be real, I know some sketchy people that probably do drugs or at least know where to find some. What I don't know, however, is any "fences". That is, someone that traffics in stolen goods. Or maybe I do, they don't exactly advertise their services. I've n…

Blaming Amazon is misplaced. Blame the people stealing and the system that refuses to prosecute them.

It’s not about blame.

If Amazon can ship products to my house within 2-hours, it certainly can crack down on selling stolen goods. It just has zero incentive to.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#353

Post by prvit »

TillE wrote: post #350
prvit wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Without American cop show bluster, without pretrial detention except for serious crimes, and without lengthy prison sentences.

Mostly, except pretrial detention for minor crimes is unfortunately still not that uncommon in Europe.

The lack of bail often makes this worse, a weird obsession with “fairness” forces us to continue locking up people with sufficient assets to insure against absconding. Poor people can’t afford bail? Better make everyone else suffer too.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#354

Post by marricks »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #297
axutio wrote: post #161

Most of the comments here are ignoring the difference between regular old shoplifting and the trend driving the increase discussed in the article, which they're referring to as "organized retail crime". I think it's very fair to have differing attitudes/moral thresholds for an impoverished mother shoplifting a week's worth of baby formula versus "a couple in Alabama [which] pled guilty to shifting $300,000-worth of s…

> I think it's very fair to have differing attitudes/moral thresholds for an impoverished mother shoplifting a week's worth of baby formula versus "a couple in Alabama [which] pled guilty to shifting $300,000-worth of stolen baby formula on eBay". I’ve also noticed a weird tendency to downplay theft lately, either through projecting a theoretical moral justification on to the shoplifter or by insinuating that retail…

No post body was provided.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#355

Post by Scoundreller »

bombcar wrote: post #231
lisper wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course not. But it is really hard to turn a profit reselling a product you purchased at retail.

You can make a small but moderate side income reselling clearance LEGO on eBay. Even with the Walmart sticker still on it, no theft involved.

Or international arbitrage. Lots of stuff sold cheaper in USA than other places. Even stuff like a big bottle of ibuprofen or allergy pills are much more expensive in Canada.

While arbitraging deodorant sounds silly, I have bought EU roll-on deodorants online before because they're not much of a thing in North America. And they don't melt into a mess in a hot car.

Deodorants are hardly a thing in SE Asia, partly because of biology/genetic differences: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/02/business/china-consumers-...

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#356

Post by magicalist »

factsarelolz wrote: post #329
acdha wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not the same claim at all - those people can and are being prosecuted: bail wouldn’t matter if they weren’t! Similarly, changing the threshold for a felony theft charge doesn’t prevent anyone from being prosecuted.

Stores aren't calling the police and if they do the police don't show up. https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-12-09/skelton-...

Maybe don't take someone running for Attorney General who wants you to know crime is out of control unless you elect them at their word alone.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#357

Post by DenisM »

josephcsible wrote: post #240
DenisM wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some societies do better than others though. It’s perfectly reasonable to set the bar at least that high.

Some societies do better than others at stopping crime too. Can we set our bar to match Singapore in that respect?

yes

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#358

Post by bhk »

public_defender wrote: post #317
bhk wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is clearly not true. > Manhattan D.A. Acts on Vow to Seek Incarceration Only for Worst Crimes > The district attorney, Alvin Bragg, told prosecutors in his office in a memo that they should ask judges for jail or prison time only for the most serious offenses — including murder, sexual assault and economic crimes involving vast sums of money — unless the law requires them to do otherwise. https://www.nytimes.com…

It clearly is true. I can actually watch it happen. You can too, if you go to arraignments in NYC. The line ADAs have no discretion to dismiss petit larceny (shoplifting) at arraignment. They need supervisor approval. There are other cases like driving under suspension (VTL 511 -- mentioned in GP) where they do have this discretion. There is a reason for the difference, which is that petit larceny is a priority. Also…

So on the one side I see news reports of dozens of cases of serial shoplifting offenders out on the streets, and the NYC DA informing his staff and letting the public know that if you steal less than $500 you will not go to jail.

But you're claiming that the DA actually intended to send them to jail. So he was baiting them to commit the crime? I don't buy it.

And you're claiming that his prosecutors have no discretion in prosecuting these cases? I don't buy it, but if you have some references to support that claim, other than word of mouth, I'm all ears.

I can't find precisely what the amendment was and when it took effect, but the subject of the article was a surge in retail theft over several years, so if you're talking about some changes in the past year, then maybe we will be able to see some effects in the next year.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#359

Post by peyton »

prvit wrote: post #338
peyton wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s called receipt of stolen property, and it’s a crime. Doesn’t matter if you’re Amazon.

Without mens rea this is not a crime in (almost?) any jurisdiction, doesn’t matter if you’re Amazon. No matter what kind of weird games you choose to play, there’s no way amazon has a guilty mind here.

You’re claiming Amazon has zero liability? Then why does Amazon employ people to deal with this problem?

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#360

Post by Scoundreller »

WalterSear wrote: post #339
nradov wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A database of serial numbers alone wouldn't be sufficient. Counterfeiters frequently copy real serial numbers and print them on fake products. There are more effective means such as tamper resistant RFID tags, but those aren't cost effective for cheap items. And often no one bothers to check anyway.

None of this refutes the fact that a blockchain would have all the same problems plus a whole load more.

Let's keep that part quiet from our VCs
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