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Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

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Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#431

Post by tinus_hn »

VBprogrammer wrote: post #379
tinus_hn wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why are the companies in the article researching the risks if according to you there clearly are no risks? Do you know better than the manufacturers?

Please try to keep the level of discussion one step above junior school. Otherwise there is no point in us communicating further. I didn't say there are no risks but those risks must necessarily be very low, as otherwise with a sample size of billions of doses issued even effects in the 1 in a million would be readily identifiable.

Right, so you already have all the answers, it’s a big mystery why the manufacturers are doing this research. A big mystery to you, that is.

Indeed there is no point in communicating further, you made up your mind years ago and you will probably never progress beyond repeating the old talking points. Luckily most of the rest of the world has started to see reality is a bit more nuanced than ‘COVID is doom, vaccine is good’.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#432

Post by xracy »

dekhn wrote: post #365
xracy wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is wild to me that people look at a number like 3/1,000,000 and don't think wow, that's 1900 Children who could die from something we have a vaccine for, that actively prevents the cause. Also, can you imagine losing a child to something that was preventable? You can play numbers and statistics all day, but we're talking about children's lives. You're probably not a parent? But for reference, go find examples of p…

You're trying to do "appeal to emotion" argument, doesn't work super well here.

Also, brief note, that you might think you're an emotionless rational machine, but very few people actually respond well to that. So it's important to use everything in your rhetorical toolbox including appeals to emotion to try and convince the wide range of responses people might have.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#433

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

atlgator wrote: post #398
serf wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's amusing to think that US politics is the only one with that problem.

Did anyone say that?

No, but then we should see more Western countries with money problems having the same issues.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#434

Post by [deleted] »

robomartin wrote: post #13

One of my kids, 15 at the time, was one of the reported cases of myocarditis. At the time of his hospitalization he was one out of 700 cases. He was in the hospital for two weeks. While under observation after his release, we have not seen indications of lasting damage. No way to know what the future holds. So far, so good. We are still not anti-vax at all. In fact, I might go for my next booster today. The one thing…

[deleted]

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#435

Post by francisduvivier »

wwweston wrote: post #261
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worth noting, the Florida Surgeon General's opinion was lambasted in the mainstream media as him embracing conspiracy theories (and there is some interesting added context there as to why they believe so). Which... maybe two things are true at once. Perhaps he was - but also, perhaps his stance is not that radical. Radical compared to most Surgeon Generals in the United States; but on an international level? https://…

There's a lot of daylight between "recommendations for some higher age groups, no recommendation for lower age groups" and "recommendation against for lower age groups." The international recommendations cited above seem to be in the former category. Florida's recommendations seem to be in the latter. This might make them an outlier. Whether it makes them conspiracy theorists is another matter. If their position is s…

Have you read this exception in the link you posted:

- "with one exception. Men under 40 who received a second dose of the Moderna vaccine had a higher risk of myocarditis followingvaccination. The Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines are available in the U.S." I'd say it's worth a mention.

But then it's also quite an unfair comparison if you compare the all the vaccinated against a filtered group of unvaccinated people.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#436

Post by akira2501 »

xracy wrote: post #205
taolegal wrote: post #10

The same people who wouldn't be charitable with, say, Exxon, are bending over backwards to defend global pharmaceuticals. Exxon has an interest in minimizing (disregarding) the harmful effects of their products and same goes for Pfizer & friends who's got every govt funneling money to them seemingly without limit.

Nah, Pfizer is a terrible company. Pharmaceutical companies can rot in hell. But that doesn't change the fact that vaccines save lives. It's not that I am bending over backwards to defend Pharma. It's that people are bending over backwards to find shitty things in the silver linings of these companies, instead of just complaining about the thunderclouds themselves like the rest of us. Corporations are big. Companies…

> It's that people are bending over backwards to find shitty things in the silver linings of these companies, instead of just complaining about the thunderclouds themselves like the rest of us.

I'm sorry.. but wasn't it the US Government make significant investments in both companies producing this therapy? Wasn't the the US Military that drove much of the initial interest into mRNA therapies in the first place?

Why do we continue to consider these companies as anything other than conduits of government research and funding? When then is it a surprise when these companies don't recognize this that people become offended?

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#437

Post by finder83 »

pantalaimon wrote: post #418
threatofrain wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A two week stay at the hospital may have amounted to over $170k at the optimistically low end.

How?! Did they have to build an extra annex to the building just for that?

And there lies the issue with propping up the demand side of the equation with unlimited money from the government rather than regulating the supply side with affordable charges.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#438

Post by xadhominemx »

robomartin wrote: post #13

One of my kids, 15 at the time, was one of the reported cases of myocarditis. At the time of his hospitalization he was one out of 700 cases. He was in the hospital for two weeks. While under observation after his release, we have not seen indications of lasting damage. No way to know what the future holds. So far, so good. We are still not anti-vax at all. In fact, I might go for my next booster today. The one thing…

Well COVID also causes myocarditis, so it’s not surprising there were a lot of cases at the hospital. The question is whether the vaccines cause myocarditis at a higher rate than unvaccinated/unboosted COVID infections. They might for young men. For every other group, unvaccinated/unboosted infection is way more likely to cause myocarditis than the vaccine.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#439

Post by origin_path »

hadlock wrote: post #387
origin_path wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fairness UK conservative media have been reporting on it (Spectator, Telegraph). But it's being blamed on lockdowns and NHS collapse. That might be true; not all countries have excess deaths and it's a bit unclear to what extent the effect is real. It depends a lot on how you model the baseline.

Which countries do not have excess deaths 2020-20201? China, Australia, NZ might be on that list as they were pretty good about keeping the virus out but I'm curious if you know of any others. That's a wide claim, that not all countries have excess deaths

We were talking about in 2022 but I see now that the original comment is flagged, sigh.

Re: Myocarditis after Covid vaccination: Research on possible long-term risks begins

#440

Post by [deleted] »

mrtesthah wrote: post #389
dayvid wrote: post #388

My main question is if the vaccine side effects are just a much milder version of what would happen if you got COVID as opposed to something vaccine specific. If that's the case, then there would be more myocarditis issues from people not vaccinating. I haven't received a straight answer on this.

> ...then there would be more myocarditis issues from people not vaccinating... Yes. Myocarditis seven times more likely with COVID-19 than vaccines https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/967801 Myocarditis Risk 17 Times Higher for Unvaccinated Patients Ages 12-30 Who Get COVID-19 Than COVID-Vaccinated Patients https://www.epicresearch.org/articles/myocarditis-risk-17-ti... Myocarditis risk significantly higher aft…

[deleted]
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