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Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

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Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#201

Post by Kwpolska »

tesseract2 wrote: post #189
Kwpolska wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another good alternative could be openSUSE: https://www.opensuse.org/ - also pretty smooth, with user-friendly configuration tools, and no snap nonsense. WSL users might also be interested in using that for their distro instead of Ubuntu.

I used to use opensuse around 2010, and had very pleasant experience with it. Things just worked, and their Yast tool was very handy. I used to joke that opensuse is the Mercedes of linux distro :). I am wondering why it isn't more popular. Is there any sentiment/experience people would like to share about this distro?

Ubuntu does a pretty good job marketing-wise, many people start they journey with Ubuntu and never look for other distros. Or on the other hand, they end up on advanced/continuous-maintenance distros like Arch Linux.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#203

Post by brnt »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #175
brnt wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seconded. Fedora is very much NOT an all-ready-out-of-the-box experience, unless you are a FLOSS dev.

> Fedora is very much NOT an all-ready-out-of-the-box experience, unless you are a FLOSS dev. Nah it's pretty close if you have an integrated Intel or AMD system, you really don't need closed-source drivers for much except Nvidia these days. Chrome is in the non-free Fedora repositories (or can be installed easily from the website with an .rpm) and that's all most normal users need.

Plus codecs, plus font rendering, plus cutting edge being too cutting edge sometimes.

Like I said, FLOSS devs don't rely on closed blobs so they don't have this problem.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#204

Post by brnt »

MichaelCollins wrote: post #161
brnt wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seconded. Fedora is very much NOT an all-ready-out-of-the-box experience, unless you are a FLOSS dev.

You don't need to be a developer, the average computer enthusiast is capable of googling the matter figuring it out. It may not be appropriate for the "colloquial grandmother" sort of user, but you certainly don't need to be a computer programmer to figure it out. There's a lot of ground in-between those. My dad is a retired accountant and a computer enthusiast since the 80s. Never a programmer, but he does this kind…

Googling =\= ootb.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#205

Post by imiric »

MichaelCollins wrote: post #158
smallerfish wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish Pop OS would tackle KDE. It's a much better DE (particularly if you like to customize), but there are very few (if any) distributions which have an opinionated tuned experience out of the box.

KDE would be superb if it weren't so buggy. KDE is aimed in the right direction, trying to do and be all the things a desktop environment should do and be. But unfortunately the implementation is frequently deficient. Even seemingly basic things frequently break, like re-applying mouse preferences when you unplug and replug your mouse: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=435113 A couple more recent annoyances, of ma…

That might be the case, but is there an alternative with a similar feature set?

The latest GNOME versions are even buggier, and when it does work, it feels like a toy project compared to KDE. It's baffling to me that it's been years since the v3 controversy, yet the project still doesn't feel as mature and polished as KDE Plasma.

All v2 forks also feel like someone's hobby project to bring disparate tools together, rather than a cohesive desktop. I'm sure some MATE and Cinnamon fans would disagree, but IMO the modern desktop experience has moved on since 2010.

Similarly with LXDE, Fluxbox and a myriad of others. These are great for certain environments, but none of them can compare to the polish that KDE has, let alone something like macOS.

To be fair, I'm not bashing on minimalistic or window manager-only setups. I've been using bspwm on Void Linux for many years now as my main working environment, and wouldn't change it for the world. But when I want to stop being productive, consume content, and not have to troubleshoot issues on my machine, I prefer to use a more featureful environment with a friendlier UI. Since macOS is out of the question, and Windows is purely for gaming (and even that is going away, thanks to Valve), KDE is pretty much my only choice on Linux. Which I've been enjoying for a few months now on NixOS.

But I do wonder if there is really a DE that can compare to it. AFAIK more ambitious projects like elementary OS, Deepin and Solus are still experimental, to the point where I don't even keep track of their updates.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#206

Post by AaronFriel »

cgriswald wrote: post #66
compsciphd wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to defend snap with the idea that it makes sense for some apps, i.e. "firefox" where updating firefox while its running is bad news. Except, snap can't update applications while they are running! i.e. try to do a snap refresh while firefox is running, nothing to update, because its running, quit it wait for all processes to die and then refresh, and it will update and cause you to wait 30-60s while it does it,…

> i.e. try to do a snap refresh while firefox is running, nothing to update, because its running, quit it wait for all processes to die and then refresh, and it will update and cause you to wait 30-60s while it does it, and then you can restart firefox. Oh, it's worse than that. When there is an update available but firefox is running you get: > % snap refresh > All snaps up to date. It doesn't even tell you there is…

This seems broken, full stop.

Can Firefox itself, when installed via Snap, notify the user that it needs security updates? If so, can users effectively do that, or do they have to know this incantation of closing, waiting, running a terminal command, and restarting?

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#207

Post by Mikeb85 »

brnt wrote: post #203
Mikeb85 wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Fedora is very much NOT an all-ready-out-of-the-box experience, unless you are a FLOSS dev. Nah it's pretty close if you have an integrated Intel or AMD system, you really don't need closed-source drivers for much except Nvidia these days. Chrome is in the non-free Fedora repositories (or can be installed easily from the website with an .rpm) and that's all most normal users need.

Plus codecs, plus font rendering, plus cutting edge being too cutting edge sometimes. Like I said, FLOSS devs don't rely on closed blobs so they don't have this problem.

> codecs

Most websites people care about use open codecs these days (Google and Netflix use VP9 and AV1, both are open and royalty-free).

Never had an issue with font rendering. And cutting edge being too cutting edge might be an issue with some dev things but having up to date Gnome and apps is fine.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#208

Post by WirelessGigabit »

overshard wrote: post #5

I used to use Ubuntu for everything and was very happy in the massive Ubuntu ecosystem with a .deb for everything till I was forced to use Snap a few releases ago for installing even some basic utils I used on a daily basis. I then had Snap constantly hang on installs and just break for no apparent reason and waste my time debugging it. It didn't "just work" anymore. Swapped to Arch and haven't looked back yet, Arch…

Is there an easy way to get Arch on WSL?

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#210

Post by derefr »

5e92cb50239222b wrote: post #157
ctoth wrote: post #148

I'm not sure precisely why, but when I first saw ads in Apt(8) I decided I wouldn't be using Ubuntu for any more personal projects. On one hand they obviously need to keep the project alive. On the other hand, putting your own ads on top of something that fundamental to the system just felt ... weird/narsty? Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done Try Ubuntu Pro beta with a free personal subscri…

Jump to Debian. It has always worked towards users' interests, and probably will continue doing that because pretty much all developers are volunteers and are running a democratically driven development process. I never understood why Ubuntu is so popular because it's 99.99% Debian, and only gives you a handful of things on top of that: predictable release schedule (which is a two-edged sword if you think about it),…

(Specific, upstream-provided) PPAs are the main reason I use Ubuntu Server. Given that they're built against Ubuntu's separately-version-sequenced package ecosystem, I can't expect PPAs that install cleanly on Ubuntu to be able to find the same packages required to install cleanly on Debian. If I could, I'd just use Debian and then forcibly add the PPAs as apt sources.
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