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Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

penntoday.upenn.edu

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Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#111

Post by maaaaattttt »

Waterluvian wrote: post #36

Anecdotally, I’m having one hell of a time with my 3yo and 5yo’s teeth. No juice. No soda. No bad snacks. Lots of dentist recommended foods and snacks. Full brushing and flossing regimen. Fluoride. Dentist applied special fluoride treatments. Trust me when I say we’re doing everything right. And yet they’re 3 and 5 and have had so many cavities. I asked my dad about it and he said my brothers and I had, frankly, poor…

I could be that their enamel is not strong enough. This could change once they get their adult teeth. Have you checked with your dentist that they are receiving enough fluoride?

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#112

Post by Eisenstein »

elevaet wrote: post #93
CrHn3 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Xylichew uses birch and beech resin and has a gum base free of plastic. To ensure I get an effective amount of xylitol, I use crystals in my tea and coffee. My child eats them with a spoon. Health Garden is one of the brands that uses birch xylitol.

How much is effective? My dentist recommended it ages ago and I kind of forgot about it. Also, any health concerns with consuming xylitol?

Health concerns for humans is potential digestive issues at high amounts (many tends of grams). Health concerns for canines is prolonged excruciating death due to live failure in rather small amounts. Don't let your dogs near xylitol.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#113

Post by Eisenstein »

londons_explore wrote: post #106
alvarezbjm-hn wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> There was a study published in Nature Genetics[0] showing big changes in oral microbiota corresponding with Neolithic and Industrial dietary change. A different diet leads to a different microbiome. I think mammals' teeth last long enough for a natural life. Of course we want a longer and better life. For instance, all my dogs by age 13 yo have lost half their teeth to rot. We are terrible owners who don't take ca…

Dog food isn't very optimal for dogs... Most wild dogs would eat almost exclusively fresh raw meat. Whereas dog food tends to be dried meat with lots of corn as a filler. People wouldn't be able to afford 100% meat dogfood, because dogs eat a lot.

> because dogs eat a lot.

Uncooked meat does not have near as many digestible calories density wise as cooked grains. Of course it would be a lot harder for them to become overweight, but the food cost would be tremendous. Remember that obligate carnivores that weigh a lot, like tigers, are incredibly expensive to feed.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#114

Post by Eisenstein »

labster wrote: post #110
eyelidlessness wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I agree, however, with your self assessment. Didn’t take long to go from glib self deprecation to judgy spectator sport. Okay holier than thou pet owner, you tell me how I’m supposed to not feed my pup kibble. She has a prescription low fat diet and there are two vendors total who supply the prescription. One supplies only kibble. The other supplies kibble and canned food. She will only eat a few bites of the canne…

The natural diet of dogs is table scraps. They’ve been eating human leftovers for thousands of years.

The natural solution for dogs which need a special restrictive diet to survive is death. I think we prefer unnatural sometimes.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#116

Post by Eisenstein »

Waterluvian wrote: post #36

Anecdotally, I’m having one hell of a time with my 3yo and 5yo’s teeth. No juice. No soda. No bad snacks. Lots of dentist recommended foods and snacks. Full brushing and flossing regimen. Fluoride. Dentist applied special fluoride treatments. Trust me when I say we’re doing everything right. And yet they’re 3 and 5 and have had so many cavities. I asked my dad about it and he said my brothers and I had, frankly, poor…

Is it really a big deal though? Their teeth are going to be replaced anyway. If it happens in the adult teeth, then worry. Serious question -- I don't have children and it is tough to tell the difference between 'actual problem' and 'parents worry too much'.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#117

Post by salicideblock »

Eisenstein wrote: post #116
Waterluvian wrote: post #36

Anecdotally, I’m having one hell of a time with my 3yo and 5yo’s teeth. No juice. No soda. No bad snacks. Lots of dentist recommended foods and snacks. Full brushing and flossing regimen. Fluoride. Dentist applied special fluoride treatments. Trust me when I say we’re doing everything right. And yet they’re 3 and 5 and have had so many cavities. I asked my dad about it and he said my brothers and I had, frankly, poor…

Is it really a big deal though? Their teeth are going to be replaced anyway. If it happens in the adult teeth, then worry. Serious question -- I don't have children and it is tough to tell the difference between 'actual problem' and 'parents worry too much'.

Teeth will be replaced one by one, and their mouth microbiome and habits will not be replaced wholesale.

Yeah, adult teeth erase some of the damage but it's not a fresh start.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#118

Post by psychphysic »

diob wrote: post #104
clumsysmurf wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you think of mouth washes that contains Cetylpyridinium Chloride (CPC)? I was reading they may help inactivate SARS-Cov-2 in saliva. I wonder though about (1) killing everything in the mouth or (2) providing oral probiotics (I take one from Life Extension). "Cetylpyridinium chloride (CPC), a quaternary ammonium compound, which is present in mouthwash, is effective against bacteria, fungi, and enveloped viruse…

If I don't use mouth wash I end up getting ulcers all over my mouth. It's strange, not sure why but my mouth can't handle living without it.

You're not rinsing your mouth out after brushing are you?

For most spitting but not rinsing is as good as mouth wash.

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#119

Post by murukesh_s »

leobg wrote: post #107
londons_explore wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go back another 2000 years or so, and nearly every one has great teeth... The switch of grain-based diets is suspected to be a big part of the cause.

AFAIK, Ötzi (3230 BC) had cavities.

well, Ötzi ate wheat..

Re: Microbes that cause cavities can form superorganisms able to ‘crawl’

#120

Post by zasdffaa »

londons_explore wrote: post #106
alvarezbjm-hn wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> There was a study published in Nature Genetics[0] showing big changes in oral microbiota corresponding with Neolithic and Industrial dietary change. A different diet leads to a different microbiome. I think mammals' teeth last long enough for a natural life. Of course we want a longer and better life. For instance, all my dogs by age 13 yo have lost half their teeth to rot. We are terrible owners who don't take ca…

Dog food isn't very optimal for dogs... Most wild dogs would eat almost exclusively fresh raw meat. Whereas dog food tends to be dried meat with lots of corn as a filler. People wouldn't be able to afford 100% meat dogfood, because dogs eat a lot.

> Most wild dogs would eat almost exclusively fresh raw meat

Is that right? I understood most wild dogs eat a fair proportion of roots/berries and other herby stuff. A quick dig around:

"Unlike cats, dogs aren’t obligate carnivores. They can and do eat vegetable matter. Wild dogs will search for rotten fruit and will eat the semi-digested contents of their prey’s stomach. Some will dig up vegetables and eat grasses and herbs"

https://honeysrealdogfood.com/in-the-wild/

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