German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage • Hacker News Board

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#71

Post by blumomo » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:04 PM UTC

marijnz wrote: post #67

hugh-avherald wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For what cause?

For the (far) right-wing party AFD https://berlinspectator.com/2022/10/08/berlin-extremist-far-...

As if they were the only organizing events. There’s so many more „right“ events happening today organized by people who want nothing more than freedom and a common sense and truth loving government. Citing „AfD“ doesn’t do favor to all the other events today who don’t need vicinity to „AfD“. Today anyone who opposes the official perspectives is automatically „right“, isn’t he?

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#72

Post by thatguy0900 » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:09 PM UTC

captainmuon wrote: post #19

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #4

Maybe I am tinfoiling too hard... In February this year there was an attack against Vodafone Portugal that brought down their whole mobile networks, 4G, 5G, and fiber, taking them several days to bring everything back up [0]. It also very clearly was a state actor, no threats, no ransom, sophisticated. Taking down pipelines, taking down comms, taking down transport infrastructure. All within a few months. Always on N…

Yeah but I would assume the same attack is not going to be successfully against the same target a second time. So they are essentially providing free pentesting. And creating a climate that allows governments to introduce much stronger security measures. Without creating much actual damage. Also I wonder if it was a physical oder purely software attack? If it was a physical attack on a critical system, it could have…

They can't cut two cables again? And Voda phone has now been made hack proof, I assume? Infrastructure is not secure, either digitally or physically. The only thing keeping them up is threats from the three letter agencies, like that hacking group that accidentally hit infrastructure and apologized for the international incident. https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/10/22428996/colonial-pipelin... there is literally nothing protecting any of these targets from state sponsored hacking or two guys with some bolt cutters and grenades. What's our success rate against Joe randoms with a rifle attacking domestic targets, much less actual trained operatives

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#73

Post by neuronic » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:10 PM UTC

dathinab wrote: post #33

In case anyone things this has anything to do with the current Russia situation, it most likely has not. Stuff like that happens every few years on larger scale and sometimes multiple times a year on smaller scale (e.g. part of Berlin local trains not going because of it). A lot of this sabotage comes from people trying to steal cables, but then also sometimes giving up in the process. Then there a climate crazed peo…

> climate crazed people

You obviously have an agenda. None of these groups blame "trains".

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#74

Post by someotherpersom » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:10 PM UTC

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #4

Maybe I am tinfoiling too hard... In February this year there was an attack against Vodafone Portugal that brought down their whole mobile networks, 4G, 5G, and fiber, taking them several days to bring everything back up [0]. It also very clearly was a state actor, no threats, no ransom, sophisticated. Taking down pipelines, taking down comms, taking down transport infrastructure. All within a few months. Always on N…

Regarding the pipelines, it seems odd to call them a NATO target when they’re largely owned by Russia. Likewise, Russia had more to gain from just holding the gas supply hostage by stopping it, but offering to return the supply were Europe to give in to demands after a cold winter or two. Meanwhile, did you watch the video of Biden threatening to take them out from this past February?

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#75

Post by Jon_Lowtek » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:13 PM UTC

blumomo wrote: post #71

marijnz wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the (far) right-wing party AFD https://berlinspectator.com/2022/10/08/berlin-extremist-far-...

As if they were the only organizing events. There’s so many more „right“ events happening today organized by people who want nothing more than freedom and a common sense and truth loving government. Citing „AfD“ doesn’t do favor to all the other events today who don’t need vicinity to „AfD“. Today anyone who opposes the official perspectives is automatically „right“, isn’t he?

the berlin event was organized by the AfD, an ethno-nationalist party, under the motto "germany first". They are fishing in the social-liberal circles claiming to be in favor of freedom and truth, but they run a well oiled propaganda machine and would rule with an iron fist should they ever take power.

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#76

Post by Jon_Lowtek » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:23 PM UTC

blumomo wrote: post #38

Coincidentally there are very big demonstrations scheduled for today in Berlin. Trains not running to Berlin is definitely reducing the amount of participants joining these events. Just saying.

The public transport outage is an opportunity for propaganda for the AfD and plays into their hands more than additional people coming to Berlin: they can exaggerate the numbers of their supporters and claim both victim-hood and relevancy. Many of their followers are in echo-chambers of group identity, inflated self-worth and conspiracy theories: stories of the government damaging civilian infrastructure in some black ops to harm their group plays right into their believes and gives them a feeling of being relevant. Their media channels are probably buzzing with such claims. just saying

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#77

Post by mensetmanusman » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:25 PM UTC

jaclaz wrote: post #62

TonyTrapp wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other articles (e.g. https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/bahn-sabotage-101.html ) do mention fibre cables.

Yep, so the copper thieves (this time) are innocent.

Silica (SiO2) thieves don’t realize the beaches are full of it.

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#78

Post by luckylion » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:27 PM UTC

ahartmetz wrote: post #68

luckylion wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't buy that theory. First of all: outside of the party "Die Linke" and the left wing of the SPD, there's little ideological friendship to Russia in German politics, it's either regular corruption (Gerhard Schröder) or industrial politics ("you give us cheap energy, we keep our eyes closed and don't mention the smell"). If anything, actions like these will make Germans more willing to spend extra money on defense…

Right wing AfD also seems to sympathize with Russia. Unclear how much because they like Putin's "traditionalist" policies and how much because they are Russian controlled shit stirrers.

Ah, yes, you're right. I didn't even consider them, because they're pretty much irrelevant, at least for now. I also believe it could be both + there's probably a bit of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" as well (the "enemy" of them being the current center-left government), and a good splash of insanity. Add tribal behavior where you're moving with the group you're a part of and I guess this is what you get.

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#79

Post by blumomo » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:30 PM UTC

Jon_Lowtek wrote: post #75

blumomo wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As if they were the only organizing events. There’s so many more „right“ events happening today organized by people who want nothing more than freedom and a common sense and truth loving government. Citing „AfD“ doesn’t do favor to all the other events today who don’t need vicinity to „AfD“. Today anyone who opposes the official perspectives is automatically „right“, isn’t he?

the berlin event was organized by the AfD, an ethno-nationalist party, under the motto "germany first". They are fishing in the social-liberal circles claiming to be in favor of freedom and truth, but they run a well oiled propaganda machine and would rule with an iron fist should they ever take power.

You get the totalitarian government you’re asking for, you deserve it!

Re: German rail operator says train disruption caused by sabotage

#80

Post by blumomo » Sat, Oct 08, 2022, 4:33 PM UTC

Jon_Lowtek wrote: post #76

blumomo wrote: post #38

Coincidentally there are very big demonstrations scheduled for today in Berlin. Trains not running to Berlin is definitely reducing the amount of participants joining these events. Just saying.

The public transport outage is an opportunity for propaganda for the AfD and plays into their hands more than additional people coming to Berlin: they can exaggerate the numbers of their supporters and claim both victim-hood and relevancy. Many of their followers are in echo-chambers of group identity, inflated self-worth and conspiracy theories: stories of the government damaging civilian infrastructure in some blac…

Everyone is talking about AfD instead of the original point of this thread. Every time there are big demonstrations in Berlin, trains stop running, highways are closed. You are talking about AfD as if they are the culprit. I wish you personally an AfD-free country. You will then first hand experience the totalitarian state structures, who needs an opposition anyway? Away with it!!