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EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

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Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#341

Post by webmobdev »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #199
webmobdev wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do people think it is a good thing to have this enforced by law is beyond me. It's because consumers have rights too. Standardising something actually fosters competition (healthy capitalism), increases profit (as standardising something often leads to lower manufacturing costs) while reducing costs for consumers (due to increased competition). It also reduces waste which is good for the environment. > I don't…

You can already buy non-Apple branded lightning cables. Apart from the cable that came in my iPhone 7's box many years ago (which still works perfectly and, excluding a little dirt, looks like new), all my other lightning cables are off-brand ones that cost much less than $20 apiece. More like 10. Some of them (Aukey brand) developed a wonky connection after a while, or only work on one side. The others (Amazon Basic…

> You can already buy non-Apple branded lightning cables.

Lightening cables are not a standard and thus Apple dictates terms even with non-Apple lightening cables. As lightening cables are not an industry standard the prices are influenced by Apple and artificially inflated (even for non-Apple ones). And they can only be used with Apple devices. (Lightening cables have seen a recent price fall only after Apple shifted to USB-C for some iDevices, as the market fears Apple is already preparing to switch to USB-C).

USB-C cables will be even cheaper in the future as they are standardised, and since they can be used with multiple devices (due to such regulations) you need to buy fewer of them too.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#342

Post by dionidium »

tgv wrote: post #19
NextHendrix wrote: post #7

This gives me some cognitive dissonance. On the one hand, having a common connector will reduce waste and be much more convenient (eg "Hey have you got an iPhone charger?") and make losing a charger a cheaper mistake. On the other hand I'm not sure I like the idea of government mandating electrical connectors on devices, which could stifle innovation, or be very shortsighted in the typical government-rules-on-tech wa…

Thank God nobody ever standardized electrical plugs. I'd hate being able to plug my vacuum cleaner and laptop in the same outlet.

This is a great example in that residential electrical systems evolve at a snails pace. There's almost no innovation and most houses are full of dangerous legacy systems because regulation makes updating difficult and expensive.

Also of note: you aren't required by national or state law to use any kind of electrical system in the U.S. The National Electric Code is not a binding document. It's up to individual municipalities to decide whether they want to adopt it (or some other standard, which they're free to do).

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#344

Post by billpg »

skohan wrote: post #40
billpg wrote: post #31

Around five years or so ago, I had lots of gadgets, all using Micro-USB. Life was good, I had purchased a job lot of cables and made sure every location on my house, car and desk at work had more than enough cables so any gadget would be ready to be charged up. Then I bought a new phone. I had a USB-C port. Suddenly, I couldn't charge it up just anywhere. If that phone had a Micro-USB version, I'd have chosen that on…

I would argue it is good enough it compensates for the hassle. I think USB-C is one of the first "good enough" connectors we have had for the arbitrary use-case. It's reversible. It's suitable for high-power and high-bandwidth use-cases. It's robust. micro-USB works ok for charging small devices, but would it really make sense to replace USB-A with it for plugging peripherals into your PC for example?

Fair point, but my lived experience of USB-C is that several of my Micro-USB cables dotted around now have little converter heads added. My tablets and battery packs (and other gizmos) still need the Micro-USB port so I can't just replace the cables.

Yes, being able to plug in the connector both ways around is nice, but it wasn't that inconvenient not to be able to do that, especially when put against the inconvenience of needing these extra heads.

I can certainly imagine someone having similar frustrations when Mini-USB gave way to Micro-USB. I can only hope that when USB-D connectors come around, there's more than only small incremental improvements to get me on board.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#346

Post by Avamander »

Krkrmfnfmmd wrote: post #320
allendoerfer wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the number one reason, why I am not upgrading and tell everyone who asks me, to not do it either. This law is so good, even its anticipation has environmental benefits.

The law will stifle further innovation for cables. Imagine still having USB A because the EU said so.

It will not, the previous one didn't either.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#347

Post by fy20 »

kypro wrote: post #34

I like USB-C and would even be in favour of the iPhone using USB-C, but I really dislike the idea that EU regulators would know what's better for consumers than consumer electronics companies and the consumers themselves. I do kind of get it though. It's probably better for a whole host of reasons if electronics all used the same cords, but I guess you could make that argument for a lot of things. There would be bene…

Are you old enough to remember the early 2000s when every phone and portable media player had it's own charger, which often wasn't even transferable between devices by the same manufacturer? It led to lots of old chargers when devices were replaced, which were useless for anything else (I remember having bags of cables and chargers). And if you wanted a second charger for whatever reason (this was before you needed to charge your device every 3 hours), you needed to find the specific charger for your device. If it was a few years old, it might not even be possible to purchase one.

Then almost by magic everyone switched to micro USB. You could charge different devices from different manufacturers with the same cable. This wasn't some feat of magic, it was because the European Commission worked to bring manufacturers to an agreement on a common charging standard.

Well, everyone except Apple, who did actually sign the agreement. They just decided to bundle a dongle to be compliant.

Mini-USB was introduced in 2000, so manufactures had plenty of time to choose a common interface themselves, but decided not to.

Even amongst Apple's own devices it is a mess. To charge an Apple Pencil with an iPad Pro you need not one, but two adapters.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#348

Post by emptyfile »

Krkrmfnfmmd wrote: post #335
cyborgx7 wrote: post #318

Self-regulation only works if government regulation is a serious threat in case self-regulation fails. In this case, self-regulation failed, so government regulation stepped in to force industry to do what is right. All the handwringing about stifling innovation is on its face ridiculous as mandates to use micro-usb didn't stop android phones from adopting the new and better standard as soon as it was viable.

Government mandates on how you can charge your phone won't stifle innovation?

Was that a question? Of course not. In fact the parent comment even provides an example.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#349

Post by garmanarnar »

Krkrmfnfmmd wrote: post #335
cyborgx7 wrote: post #318

Self-regulation only works if government regulation is a serious threat in case self-regulation fails. In this case, self-regulation failed, so government regulation stepped in to force industry to do what is right. All the handwringing about stifling innovation is on its face ridiculous as mandates to use micro-usb didn't stop android phones from adopting the new and better standard as soon as it was viable.

Government mandates on how you can charge your phone won't stifle innovation?

Correct! In fact it can even help innovation.

Re: EU Passes Law to Switch iPhone to USB-C by End of 2024

#350

Post by pwpw »

coffeeblack wrote: post #240
emaro wrote: post #218

I agree with the overall tone in the comments here: yay in general, but what a shame a law needs to specify a specific port for ~iPhones~ devices. I really like USB-C. It's sooo convenient to charge my notebook, my headphones, my phone, my everything with the same cable. However what bothers me since someone pointed it out to me: for phones, which are used all day in all kind of situations, lightning has a big andvan…

Very much agree. The port design of lightning is superior, too bad that now a law mandates Apple to sell the inferior solution. But that’s what you get when laws eliminate competition.

Bell Labs allowed others to produce transistor based hearing aids royalty free. Volvo allowed others to use a 3-point harness system royalty free. Apple created Lightning to solve a problem and wanted royalties on all products using it. Naturally, the market moved to another solution.

While Lightning may be a good piece of technology, I think Apple is largely to blame for its demise. Standardization is good for consumers. Apple had control over its fate. I don’t blame them for wanting to collect royalties, but they were the only major manufacturer on the market not playing ball with a standardized port. Yet even their other products use USB-C, and the MacBook was actually an early adopter.

Accordingly, I don’t think this law eliminates competition. It brings simplification to consumers for a simple, boring port that can now be shared with many of their other goods and a single cable.

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