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Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

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Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to wonder what Mozilla are doing with $400m a year.

They've put improving their browser on hold to focus on their new passion: fighting decentralized software https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/blog/fellow-research-decen...

I wonder who else would benefit from fighting against more decentralisation.. Maybe big tech? The same big tech that also who funds Mozilla?

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#222
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1password is going to implement WebAuthn in the future: https://blog.1password.com/1password-is-joining-the-fido-all... However, the lock-in concern remains: how can you export passkeys to another password manager the same way you can export passwords to it?

Well, the point of such keys is that you can't extract the private part. I've never met a single service that supports Webauthn and doesn't allow you to have multiple tokens: every time I enroll into a new service, I do this: add physical key, add desktop (Windows Hello) if it's personal, add laptop (Touch ID) of it's work and maybe Face ID on iPad.

I have close to a thousand unique websites and passwords in my password manager. It is completely unreasonable for me to expect to re-enroll a thousand times.

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#224
post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The win11 / Edge bullshit finally pushed me to migrate my last win machine to linux. I used to love Windows, nowadays it just makes me bitter. Do you know typing "torrent" in the start menu doesn't find "qbittorrent"? In 2022. It sums it all. And the acquisitions... I've had countless minecraft sessions ruined because of microsoft account / store issues. Don't even get me started on realms and the chat policing bulls…

Oddly enough I can't find a better programming environment nowadays than the win, wsl, powertools combo. I noticed the same about qbittorrent tho.

I'm one of those weird people that genuinely enjoys using windows as my main OS. vc++ and c# stuff is very nice on that OS, but I still feel like wsl is a bit like shoving a square peg into a round hole. too often, things that "just work" on a full-fledged linux install fail on wsl for some obscure reason.

my solution is to use windows for GUI things, and a remote linux instance for actual building/running/deploying services. vs code server is really nice for this, you can essentially run it as a GUI thin client locally that controls a headless remote that does all the heavy lifting. it's pretty seamless if you're willing to accept that you need a network connection to get any work done.

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The win11 / Edge bullshit finally pushed me to migrate my last win machine to linux. I used to love Windows, nowadays it just makes me bitter. Do you know typing "torrent" in the start menu doesn't find "qbittorrent"? In 2022. It sums it all. Heh, try KDE's KRunner. I type 'kt' and it matches ktorrent. But if I type 'kto' it switches to matching "Des kto p 8". 'ktor' once again matches ktorrent.

That's a common autocomplete behaviour. It's trying to be helpful. If you actually wanted ktorrent, you probably would have selected ktorrent on 'kt'. By typing another letter you're hinting you might want something other than ktorrent. Not sure if I agree with the behaviour, but I understand it.

Here's one I'm quickly finding tedious in Fedora:

"Chery"

I'm misspelling CherryTree.

Instead of getting note taking software, VLC starts playing "11 - Pulmonary Archery (Explicit).flac"

This is annoying not just because it's not what I wanted, but also because I already have music playing, music which is now abruptly cut off.

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#228
post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My comment said nothing about Safari or iOS, and Google's pushing goes far beyond just Android. Using any Google product in a non-Google browser will trigger a "Download Chrome!" dialog, and that includes things like Google's search which practically everybody uses. It's even present in Gmail, Sheets, etc on iOS, where instead of using the default browser when tapping links it will show a chooser that includes Chrome…

> Using any Google product in a non-Google browser will trigger a "Download Chrome!" dialog, and that includes things like Google's search which practically everybody uses. This has not been my experience. I even did a Google search for something random and could not find any "Download Chrome!" message anywhere (I'm using Firefox). I do remember some years back there was such a message somewhere on Google search, tho…

I just tested and I couldn't get it to appear when using Firefox on macOS or Windows or under Edge on macOS, but it appeared right away under Edge for Windows[0] and Safari on macOS[1]. So it seems that they target default browser configs specifically.

On iOS in a private tab, Google doesn't try to push Chrome but instead the Google app, which functions as a browser.

[0]: https://i.ibb.co/Htk645k/Screenshot-2022-09-23-183455.png [1]: https://i.ibb.co/thnRN7P/Screenshot-2022-09-23-at-6-42-14-PM...

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any chance that third party password managers like Bitwarden and 1Password will be able to implement add-ons and apps that replace this functionality, and that could open up migration paths? Or is the passkey future even worse than I feared?

I believe 1password will implement passkeys at some point in the future. However that doesn't take away from the concern that passkeys are designed from the ground up to ensure vendor lock-in (there almost certainly won't be a way to migrate passkeys from Apple's or Google's keychains to 1password). With passwords there is a clear, if insecure, fallback -- simply copy the password over. With passkeys, you're subject…

> there almost certainly won't be a way to migrate passkeys from Apple's or Google's keychains to 1password

If that happens it will be 100% the fault of those specific passkey implementations. There's no reason why exporting a passkey database should be any more difficult than exporting a password database.

That isn't to say I disagree with you though.

Re: Mozilla claims Apple, Google and Microsoft force users to use default browsers

#230
post #140
post #3

They're right, recently I've installed some Windows update for my parents and I had to reject like 5 suggested changes - installing Office trial, switching default browser to Edge yet again, and more. But this goes way beyond the browsers - I've never explicitly installed Keychain on my iphone and yet it shows as an option next to 1password every time I fill in a password field. Google calendar asks me to install an…

The win11 / Edge bullshit finally pushed me to migrate my last win machine to linux. I used to love Windows, nowadays it just makes me bitter. Do you know typing "torrent" in the start menu doesn't find "qbittorrent"? In 2022. It sums it all. And the acquisitions... I've had countless minecraft sessions ruined because of microsoft account / store issues. Don't even get me started on realms and the chat policing bulls…

So much for the modern, developer and open source-friendly narrative

That's exactly what it is: encouraging "developers", some of whom IMHO shouldn't even be writing software, to indulge in "coding" while completely ignoring and antagonising the user perspective. Countless users' workflows just broken with no recourse just because some selfish bastard wanted to use something "new and different" without considering the wider effects. When the culture only cares about promoting new and shiny tools/frameworks/etc. to developers and feeding their appetite for otherwise useless things, and in doing so, forsakes the original purpose of software, this is the result.

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