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US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

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Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#291

Post by JohnFen »

Operyl wrote: post #250
sjf wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For people renting it is routine to receive mail for several previous tenants. Everytime you throw away a credit card sign-up offer for someone else, you are committing a felony.

Yup! Write "Not at this Address" and put it in the outbox if you have one, or back in your mailbox with flag up.

I've been routinely receiving junk mail for a person that I know for a fact has been dead for about a decade. I used to do this with that mail, but stopped a couple of years ago. Now I just toss it directly in the recycling bin.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#292

Post by algoatecorn »

shabbatt wrote: post #278
algoatecorn wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? I'm asking about the realistic outcome, whether that be denial of border crossing, criminal charges, or they choose to not examine the device and let you through.

now what if you bought the phone off craigslist?

That's likely not relevant since during a border crossing your identity has already been verified.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#293

Post by MichaelCollins »

MockObject wrote: post #226
lisper wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was specifically asking if there are examples of people being killed by police for refusing a search without a warrant No, you weren't. You asked: "Can you cite any examples of *this* happening? I’m a pretty big policing reform person and follow this stuff closely and can’t think of a single case *like this*." [Emphasis added] The semantics of that question turn entirely on the antecedent of "this", which is pret…

No, it was clear that he was asking about >>> you also may say "no" >> people have been killed by law enforcement for doing what you are suggesting. > Can you cite any examples of this happening? and not George Floyd.

At this point it should be clear that no such examples exist.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#294

Post by shabbatt »

algoatecorn wrote: post #292
shabbatt wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

now what if you bought the phone off craigslist?

That's likely not relevant since during a border crossing your identity has already been verified.

"how was i supposed to know the phone i bought on craigslist had a payload?"

plausible deniability.

edit: please dont actually do this.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#295

Post by bagels »

boring_twenties wrote: post #213
bagels wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not just throw it away yourself?

It was out of my sight for half an hour, I'm not so much as touching it again after that.

What harm would happen if you touched it long enough to put it in a trash can? You were concerned they may have poisoned it or something? I completely understand not wanting to operate it since they could have backdoored it or put tracking devices in it, etc.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#296

Post by MerelyMortal »

jdeibele wrote: post #277
jliptzin wrote: post #45

This happened to me in 2016 crossing into Canada. Borders agents took my phone for no reason, demand I give them the password to unlock it (otherwise they would seize the phone), took it in the back for 45 min before returning it and letting me enter. I think it’s obvious they took all my data. So now when I travel I just bring my “travel” phone with no sensitive data on it.

One approach would be to upload everything, wipe the phone, then log back in but not connect to iCloud (or Google). Once you've cleared the border, go to a coffee shop and download over their WiFi. Or not, if you're on a unlimited data plan. That has the advantage of requiring only one phone but would definitely look like you were hiding something. So your approach of a travel phone is better.

That won't prevent anything if they install malware that persists after a factory reset.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#297

Post by bigbacaloa »

Tijdreiziger wrote: post #49
refurb wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Searching your phone is a humans rights violation? I mean, I get the hyperbole, but I'd say more like a privacy issue. But hey, just add the US to the long list of countries like Canada, UK, Australia, etc, etc, etc. Maybe we can come up with a positive list of countries that won't search your phone at the border?

Privacy is a human right. United Nations Declaration of Human Rights (UDHR) 1948, Article 12: “No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.” https://privacyinternational.org/explainer/56/what-privacy

Privacy is not a right under US law. The US constitution makes no mention of it and the interpretive framework that creates such a right was recently overthrown in the antiRoe ruling.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#298

Post by JohnFen »

kornhole wrote: post #225
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #39

Terrifying for only 2 reasons: 1. Any malicious person savvy enough to pull off a crime of interest to the Feds is smart enough to provide a wiped or burner phone to DHS/ICE, and they have to know this. So, what is the point in doing this if not to target law abiding citizens. 2. USGOV has a spotty track record of keeping this information secure. A foreign actor is likely to access this info eventually. As one former…

I think I know what you mean when you say Luddites, but the Luddites were actually very knowledgeable about technology. They rebelled against technology being used against them without any benefit to them. If you understand that history, you might agree with me that we want Luddites such as Wyden in government.

I do think it's a shame that nobody seems to understand what the Luddites were actually about. They weren't ignorant of or against technology at all. Their beef was about economics.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#299

Post by Arrath »

I often buy a cheap pay-as-you-go phone in my destination country when I travel (mostly because I think something internal is funky with my phone, despite all arrangements being made and plans authorized with my carrier for international travel/service, the damn thing never finds signal), I may just start leaving my own phone at home when I do so.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#300

Post by jung_at_heart »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #275
jung_at_heart wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2014, I (an American) refused to give my passwords to Canada and they denied me entry and never gave me back my phone or laptop.

How can USA deny you entry to your home country? Where are they going to send you?

Edited to make it clear I meant that Canada denied me entry and stole my electronics. (Context was https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32864997#32866297 )

Thanks

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