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Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

bloomberg.com

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Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#571

Post by UncleMeat »

verisimi wrote: post #531
smolder wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your "crime" is just bringing up vaccines in a context where it's wholly irrelevant, presumably as a low effort way of stirring up more low quality argument about vaccines and related subjects. This follow-up post of yours is supporting evidence that you brought up vaccines for no good reason.

Is it inconceivable that vaccine could cause difficulties for people in conceiving? If so, how is it irrelevant? Re evidence, I have posted articles about data analysis etc. These are also frequently flagged. In general though, I have little faith in the scientific establishments. It seems clear that they are politicised, and are serving agendas. In what world can an 80 year old be in charge of medical policy for dec…

Inconceivable? No. Dismissed via medical research? Yes.

“I refuse to believe experts and instead substitute my own hunches based on zero data whatsoever” is not a good way of making medical decisions.

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#572

Post by throwayyy479087 »

chitowneats wrote: post #58
SQueeeeeL wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure Korea has pretty shit work/life balance. And if you lose your job you're also SoL. There's still a substantial amount of instability and psychic stressors that could lead to someone not wanting kids, on top of constantly fearing war with NK

I can assure you from personal experience that the average South Korean is not "constantly fearing war with NK" or anything close to it.

Same. Most seem extremely concerned about how to get into that new restaurant or other normal human things.

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#573

Post by _aavaa_ »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #489
_aavaa_ wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except unlike the foxes which eat their rabbits to near extinction, and therefore soon join them, humans can change the rules of the system they're in. Calculating the carrying capacity of the world before agriculture would have given you a much different number than after it.

Humanity can't just unilaterally decide to violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics.

Nobody said we'd have to

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#574

Post by _aavaa_ »

labster wrote: post #275
_aavaa_ wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Past performance is no guarantee of future results By that logic we shouldn't be applying arguments like "It is quite normal in ecology to see crashes and recovery in the event of overpopulation".

My scenario is several orders of magnitude more common than yours. It doesn’t mean you’re wrong; miracles do happen. It must be nice to have so much blind faith in technological progress and human exceptionalism, but I’m going to stay with my ecology and statistics.

It's several orders of magnitude more common in species which have orders of magnitude less ability to impact their environment and change the way they live (and to humans in the past when we were no different).

It is not blind faith to say that we should expect that the different dynamics could be different when the rules of the game are different.

Again, if the foxes see the rabbit population declining and can start producing rabbit substitute before they start starving, of course we would expect a different dynamic to be possible.

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#575

Post by sidewndr46 »

missedthecue wrote: post #543
sidewndr46 wrote: post #501

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm more concerned that a congressman was able to "fix" an issue with a visa than I am with someone taking bribes. Bribes implies quid pro quo. Someone who can "fix" some implies an exclusive network of favors traded with no record.

Basically what happened was that the USPS lost my passport in the mail a few days before I was supposed to move overseas. I called his office and they were able to lean on the The Department of State to have a new one printed up and issued to me within 48 hours. How he did it, I don't know, but I assume getting a call from a sitting congressman lights the proverbial fire under the ass of paper pushers at the Departme…

This is what concerns me. There shouldn't be this "shadow process". I've heard from other individuals in the same situation who were left with no recourse.

The only process should be the official process as laid out by the Department of State.

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#576

Post by upupandup »

cloutchaser wrote: post #375
nunb wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this topic very interesting. My observation (anecdata-lly, but I would love to see RCTs or perhaps a cleanly designed ANOVA study) is that these symptoms of infertility are particularly (world-wide) prevalent in people who have (usually undiagnosed) metabolic syndrome & low cholecalciferol. In almost all South-east Asian countries in particular, I have noticed high levels of sucrose consumption so I am curious…

Has anyone ever studied whether long term contraception use has an effect on fertility later on? Seems like that could be a reason too.

The weirdest part of it all is I see censorship, gaslighting when you bring up contraception possibly having impact on fertility. All discourse around it is stopped. We can't even question it. But we do know that contraception in developed countries were pushed heavily and is it concidence that in countries that don't have access to it have unchanged birth rates?

Even without evidence of contraceptions impact on fertility, when you repeatedly disrupt a natural process such as through abortion, is it any surprise that most development countries have dwindling birth rates? Is it a surprise that a country like South Korea with high abortion rate have the lowest birth rate?

Correlation may not mean causation but the probability is high. What doesn't help is that we censor/cancel people for even mentioning that abortion/contraception have unknown impact on fertility and we are left guessing what else it could be: plastic? air pollution? marijuana? All of these have been without previous generation but what was absent then compared to today was the ready availability of contraceptives/abortion.

Women have more power and independence than anytime in history, they can have a career, they can be sexually active, they can abort their fetus or put in their body all sorts of ways to prevent pregnancy. Is it any surprise that they are now finding it difficult to conceive?

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#577

Post by mrcheesebreeze »

pnut wrote: post #430
creakingstairs wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As other people have mentioned, its about not being able to afford to buy a house to raise kids in. I do want to also mention though, a unique Korean system called "Jeonse", which is a large deposit that is 50-80% of the property value. After putting in the deposit, you can live there on yearly basis without paying rent. This system has been and is being used as property ladder for young families (as they don't have…

Keeping up with the Jeonses, that's how they get you.

lol

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#578

Post by lr4444lr »

missedthecue wrote: post #544
lr4444lr wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also unstated: does the HVAC guy's wife work?

no, stay at home mom.

I have not yet found a single planned 3rd child among my colleagues and associates in situations where both husband and wife work full time (without live in help, or at least someone who comes to the house full time to watch the kids before and even a little after the parents come home). Not saying it won't happen that I will eventually find one, but I find it to be the single biggest predictor of having more than 2 kids.

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#579

Post by [deleted] »

d0100 wrote: post #494
legutierr wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was downvoted in my other comment, so I think I should explain what I meant. My point was that there is no “we” when we speak of humanity as a broad aggregate this way. There are specific constituencies—for instance, Bolsenaro and his supporters in Brazil—who are blocking the policies that most of us want to implement to stop climate change. It’s not “we” who are the problem, it’s “them”. If you blame humanity in t…

Leave it to "first world" countries that already killed off all their nature to grandstand on another country with still virgin land...

[deleted]

Re: Korea shatters its own record for world’s lowest fertility rate

#580

Post by timbit42 »

iammjm wrote: post #17

Peter Zeihan wrote a really interesting book about this topic recently - "The End of the World is Just the Begining". He sees population decline as one of the gravest dangers facing civilisation. Implication being in the title of the book.

Population decline is a danger to the world's economies but it will be good for the planet.
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