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Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

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Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#151

Post by dylan604 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #97
dylan604 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What are the right questions for a buyer to ask in order to ensure they're not left in this unfortunate position? Just a few spit balls for you: Do you have another used car for sale that is not a Tesla? Does this Tesla have any features currently enabled that might be disabled when someone realizes I'm no longer the original owner or the current owner realizes their credit card is still paying for services they no…

You could just as easily get screwed by GM, Ford, or any other legacy automaker. Your remedies are always legal or regulatory in nature, and you can’t rely on brand alone to ensure a satisfactory ownership experience.

I've never had a legacy car that could over-the-air disable things. Maybe OnStar or similar could do something, but not like the level that Tesla took things.

You're "remedies are always legal" is a bit flat. Tell to the parent that is in a rush to take their 2.34 kids to school before heading to work that they need to contact a lawyer before starting their day. And when is the last time a call to a lawyer fixed anything within any kind of quick turn time? So now you're without a car until lawyers "fix" things.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#153

Post by markus_zhang »

bambax wrote: post #80

> To be extra clear, I don't post this stuff because I hate Tesla or anything. In fact, it's just the opposite. I hate seeing Tesla derail themselves with this kind of nonsense. I respect the OP for saying this. But I have a hard time respecting people buying Teslas, or anything from Musk. Is it not obvious that the guy is a charlatan? (and that the fish rots from the head?) How likely is it that you won't be robbed…

I don't like him and I don't think he is that important to Tesla and SpaceX nowadays. But he did contribute at least at the beginning.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#154

Post by zippergz »

giarc wrote: post #79
zcw100 wrote: post #48

So the way I'm reading the post is Tesla swapped out a battery pack for a 60 with a 90 and enabled the 90. Tesla, years later, discovers that even though the hardware for a 90 was installed it should have been software limited to be a 60. (I'm assuming that Tesla only made the owner pay the cost of the 60 battery swap even though they replaced it with a 90). They go and "fix the glitch" and set it back to the 60. Sin…

The odd part is the OP said it was "badged as a 90" which to me implies Tesla also removed the physical badges on the car and replaced them to indicate it was a P90. That, to me, really implies they wanted to make this a P90 car.

Or one of the previous owners did it. I have known people who have modified the badges on their car.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#155

Post by balls187 »

HWR_14 wrote: post #136
balls187 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If my RTX3080 breaks, and Nvidia sends me a 3080Ti as a replacement(because maybe they don't have any 3080 in stock) then no, they can't lock it down to 3080 level 3 years later with a software update. And yes, I'm allowed to sell it on as a 3080Ti, because....that's what it is. What if it's a 3080Ti PCB but inside a RTX3080 card? Is it ethical to sell it as a 3080Ti? What about an RTX3080 Card that Nvidia drivers…

The proper analogy is that your Alienware breaks, and Alienware replaces your RTX3080 with a 3080Ti. When you resell it, you can and should identify it as an Alienware with a 3080Ti.

Upon closer analysis, all analogies will break down. I'd argue the car in the sumtotal of all the parts in it.

So rather your analogy about Alienware is: You own a dell gaming pc. Under warranty repair, Dell replaces some of the parts with parts from an Alienware build.

Are you allowed to put on Alienware decals on your Dell desktop and re-sell it as an Alienware?

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#157

Post by Retric »

HWR_14 wrote: post #134
zcw100 wrote: post #48

So the way I'm reading the post is Tesla swapped out a battery pack for a 60 with a 90 and enabled the 90. Tesla, years later, discovers that even though the hardware for a 90 was installed it should have been software limited to be a 60. (I'm assuming that Tesla only made the owner pay the cost of the 60 battery swap even though they replaced it with a 90). They go and "fix the glitch" and set it back to the 60. Sin…

> Presumably this cost them a fortune to do it in the first place. Why not get some good will out of it? "Hey sorry about your battery. We only had a 90 so we threw that in there. As I understand it, all batteries are the same size. They are just software locked. So no additional costs. It's the same as how Tesla remote unlocked the battery life of people fleeing natural disasters. Which means not only is it there, i…

The batteries weigh different amounts so it isn’t just software locking at the factory. https://themotordigest.com/how-much-do-tesla-batteries-weigh...

It’s more likely they didn’t have a 60kWh battery at the time pack to do the replacement. Which brings up an interesting point, a 90kWh battery software locked to 60kWh is a defective part as the added weight takes more energy to move around, has worse acceleration, more tire and break ware etc.

It’s therefore likely Tesla failed to provide an equivalent replacement part and thus broke their warranty contract.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#158

Post by lizardactivist »

I had no idea they could even do something like this remotely.

What else can they do? Shut the engine off? Lock the steering? What intelligence agencies have access? What if a side-channel can be created and (other) malicious actors obtain access?

This kind of remote access to a car is genuinely terrifying.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#159

Post by thumbsup-_- »

This is the problem with over the air updates. It gives car companies the ability to disable features at their own will. Another aspect is that software has bugs and an update can potentially also introduce problems in your car, especially when your 10yr model is receiving updates that the software engineer didn't care to test for such old model. I always liked software that runs stable software and keeps running that way forever.

Re: Tesla remotely converts battery pack, cutting 1/3 of range

#160

Post by [deleted] »

Enginerrrd wrote: post #10

I'll spare the moral judgements against Tesla for this: The real moral of the story here is that if your business plan and practices is creating occasional weird issues and huge cognitive dissonance in your customers, it's the wrong business plan. Also... the number of people this applies to is likely so low that Tesla really screwed up by not erring on the side of the customer. (They didn't buy from Tesla, but they'…

[deleted]
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