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Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

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Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#461

Post by BooneJS »

rustybelt wrote: post #445
throwaway81523 wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hadn't heard of the Wonderlic test before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_test Interesting and a bit creepy. I think here in California for nerds who have been around for a while, companies have at least some concept of what competitive rates are, so I hadn't worried about posted salary ranges. If they waste your time leading up to a lowball offer, they at least have wasted their own time as well, so they…

It’s famously administered to all nfl quarterbacks. Tom Brady got a 33.

All NFL players, not just quarterbacks, right?

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#463

Post by sokoloff »

sys_64738 wrote: post #432
akavi wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I refuse to work for companies that don't explicitly evaluate programming ability when interviewing engineers. I want to know that the people I'll be working with are at least baseline competent in that regard.

That’s OK if you’re a junior engineer with less than ten years experience but I would feel insulted if you question my credibility.

I’ve interviewed more than a few 10+ years of claimed experience engineers who couldn’t write a function to sum a list/array of integers.

There are incompetent charlatans that you’re competing against and if you’re not willing to engage to demonstrate that you’re not, some will (not entirely unreasonably) assume that you might be one.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#464

Post by ev1 »

SauciestGNU wrote: post #393
renlo wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think parent understands your point, but, it's implied that the salaries were high, so your example doesn't fit. > Our salary offerings are very aggressive to the developer's benefit Your example covers the case of "mid-range salary", overqualified applicant doesn't want the job, but wasn't going to get hired anyways because overqualified. Parent's example covers "very high salary", underqualified applicant wants t…

Not who you're asking, but I take "very aggressive to the developer's benefit" with a mountain of salt, because everytime I've come across someone saying that the eventual comp was extremely poor and they were either deliberately lying or completely out of touch with the labor market.

Every time I have a recruiter explicitly tell me that they are "top of market value comp" and keep reiterating it, I already know there's going to be no stock or bonus and the total comp is probably 1/5 of what I get now and "can't" do a signing bonus. I have not had one that doesn't meet this benchmark yet.

The ones that actually pay top of market rate I reach out to, not the other way around.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#465

Post by sokoloff »

mlyle wrote: post #344
JoshuaDavid wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that is definitely a possibility. My point was "the average quality of candidates goes down when you post a salary range" can be true even if the salary range is very good .

It's possible, but I don't know that we should rush to believe that's the case based on an anecdote of a single flawed experiment when there's simpler explanations. (Especially since it's only a problem if the higher pay motivates more bad applicants that are hard to distinguish from good applicants. If it encourages 100 people who have no relevant experience to apply, that brings the average down, but it doesn't inc…

It does however increase the level of effort to find the wheat.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#466

Post by strunz »

kedean wrote: post #427
jacquesm wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Save for one year then take 6 years off and come out roughly the same. That seems like an absolute no-brainer to me.

> roughly the same Except now you have a 6 year gap on your resume to explain and probably a 6 year degradation of skills unless you're really disciplined.

Nobody cares about gaps in resumes. I swear people think it's 1990 still. If you have desirable tech skills, that's all that matters.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#467

Post by celdon25 »

maxwell wrote: post #406
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly why. Interviewing can easily eat up 2-3 days of your life. You only get 15-30 days of vacation per year. Theoretically, you are working to have free time. This is maybe 1/5th of your free time per year. You can't waste this on unknowns. Give me the salary up front or p#$$ off.

> You only get 15-30 days of vacation per year. This is why I'm glad to have "unlimited" PTO (subject to manager approval + must be requested at least the duration in advance, e.g. 2 weeks notice for 2 weeks off), along with a few annual company-wide breaks and an earned month-long break every 3 years.

Unlimited PTO is often abused as way to prevent workers from feeling like they have the ability to take vacations when they need them.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#468

Post by johnchristopher »

Markoff wrote: post #219
johnchristopher wrote: post #130

That title is misleading. Reading that blog post it should really be "Tell HN: You can't hire me because you don't post salary ranges" or "Tell HN: I don't apply for jobs without salary ranges".

isn't it same any way you look at it?

Definitely not.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#469

Post by eddof13 »

I think for cold applications this is probably the case, salary ranges (if competitive) will help encourage people to apply.

However, recently I've opted to just response to LinkedIn messages that seem interesting. Many of them have the range, or if not, I just respond asking what the salary range is prior to having a call with them. Most of the time I get a response, and if not, then to the dustbin they go.

Re: Tell HN: You can't hire because you don't post salary ranges

#470

Post by Aeolun »

kokanator wrote: post #32

We just went through a large hiring cycle. We posted two versions for every job posting- one with salary ranges and one without. The ads performed equally well in regard to total responses with the better candidates responding to the ones without salary ranges. And... before you say, perhaps your salary ranges were bad, they weren't. Our salary offerings are very aggressive to the developer's benefit. In my opinion,…

Of course I want a good job, but I do not want a good job at the expense of salary, nor do I want to interview for hours before finding the company isn’t willing to honor my expectations (at least I can make mine clear up front).
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