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EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

consilium.europa.eu

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Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#751

Post by thunkshift1 »

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #482
thunkshift1 wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is forcing you too do that. But they are forcing apple to give anyone using apple devices the option to use the banks shitty ui app. Maybe the ui app will stop being shitty as the usage goes up? That is the point

> No one is forcing you too do that. The bank will by discontinuing Apple Pay support. They have every incentive to do so.

Why would you use apple pay if you are planning to use a banking app? Isnt the point of having a banking app so you dont have to completely depend on apple pay?

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#752

Post by tradertef »

627467 wrote: post #661
whywhywhywhy wrote: post #414

I do wish iPhones could use alternate browser engines and bypass the Apple 30% cut, but the fact I'm having to click through one of those stupid cookie dialogs on this page just leaves the bad taste in my mouth of how much the EU regulation screwed up the internet the last time they made a change like this. Not saying I want tracking cookies everywhere, but they should have just made tracking cookies illegal outright…

I left Europe before the full enforcement of this cookies dialog and everytime I spend time there I'm like: how can anyone accept this state of affairs

Exactly my situation. I was there for a business trip a couple of weeks ago and all those dialogs make the experience of web horrible.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#753

Post by cebert »

> ensure that the basic functionalities of instant messaging services are interoperable, i.e. enable users to exchange messages, send voice messages or files across messaging apps

I am not a cryptography expert, but doesn’t this requirement make it more difficult to have end-to-end encryption unless users take key exchange into their own hands?

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#754

Post by kevincox »

bun_at_work wrote: post #341
origin_path wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth noting that Android already allows such things and there has been no malware apocalypse. In all the years Android existed I've never encountered someone with a malware filled phone. People stick with the default app store and are fine. Agree about the EU though.

The entire history of Android is filled with malware stories. Google has gotten better about moderating their PlayStore, but there have been plenty of flashlight apps or similarly dumb apps that are just rootkits, bitcoin miners, or more malicious forms of malware.

You are talking about malware in the official app store, not how installing software via alternative appstores or without an app store is worse.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#755

Post by bogwog »

simondotau wrote: post #182
impalallama wrote: post #129

I'm very interested to see how this will affect closed gaming platforms like Nintendo, Sony, etc. Personally I'd love to be able to install an itch.io app on my switch and play some silly indies.

If this law doesn’t force the consoles to open up, it will prove that it was not grounded in real principles. Consoles are computers, just as surely as an iPhone is.

> Consoles are computers, just as surely as an iPhone is.

I don’t think most people see it that way. Game consoles could be general purpose computers if you changed the operating system, but no one (except maybe PS3 customers) buys a game console expecting to use it for general computing.

Likewise, the computer in a Tesla is probably powerful enough to run a full desktop operating system, but it’s clearly not what it was designed for, not what anyone bought it for, and not what anyone reasonably expects it to be used for.

Smartphones are indisputably general purpose computing devices.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#756

Post by oneoff786 »

nemothekid wrote: post #178
bloppe wrote: post #81

It blows my mind how many people have bought into Apple's position on this. No, Apple restricting your freedom does not afford you greater security. You, as an adult, can choose not to install shady software. If you're not confident in your ability to tell shady from legit, just stick to the App Store. Don't demand that Apple treat the rest of us like children just because that's how you would like to be treated.

> You, as an adult, can choose not to install shady software. For some reason every Linux user assumes everyone is as smart as they are and anyone who doesn't take the time to learn whatever esoteric config file to manage their DE is a child that can't tell left from right. Somehow the decade of directed scams and proliferation of malware and spyware isn't a problem and it's the developers "right" to be able to turn…

So demand regulation against the tracking. Demanding everyone spread their butt cheeks to Apple because you like something that someone else could do is nonsense.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#757

Post by bubblethink »

martimarkov wrote: post #694
bubblethink wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an extremely popular opinion. It's the tech grandma phenomenon. A lot of people in tech want to optimise for their grandmas. So whenever something like this is proposed, the standard response is, 'But what about my grandma ?'. It's a variation of the 'But what about the kids ?' argument.

But what about me? I’m the one who likes the fact I don’t need to worry about malware on my phone and I open sensitive documents only on my phone without any anxiety that they might get leaked. I feel a lot of ppl in tech actually don’t care about the end user and care only about the profit they can make while completely disrespecting my privacy. How about that being the phenomenon?

You will always have the option of sticking to Apple's recommended practices (their app store, their payment system, etc.). So what's the issue ?

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#758

Post by jiggunjer »

cronix wrote: post #335
brtkdotse wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a popular opinion around here, but the reason I like my iPhone is _because_ it’s a walled garden. It just works, reliably, without surprises, for years on end.

And what in the new law would prevent them from continuing to make the same "reliable without surprises" iPhone experience you seemingly enjoy? I don't see anything that prevents them from saying "We can only guarantee an Apple-level experience by using apps vetted by Apple and download directly from the official Apple App Store." Most companies that I'm aware of don't have to warranty issues arising from after marke…

I'd argue appliances should be walled and computers shouldn't be.

I think the form factor is very relevant. A MacBook is treated like a computer. A phone is treated like an appliance.

Most phone/tablet users want the convenience of modular functionality without vetting the source. Said functionality should also be easy to discover and add/remove, hence app stores.

Whereas on a computer, app stores are ignored if they even exist. Most people install after doing their own Googling or seeing it run on another MacBook.

In my opinion phones intended for general purpose computing should have distinct marketing and different software-related features.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#759

Post by hammyhavoc »

brtkdotse wrote: post #185
yoavm wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly enough, an iPhone that complies with these demands is actually the first iPhone I'd ever consider paying for. I wonder if this might actually increase adoption.

It’s not a popular opinion around here, but the reason I like my iPhone is _because_ it’s a walled garden. It just works, reliably, without surprises, for years on end.

Nothing wrong with a sensible OOBE, but please, some mercy for the power/niche users.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#760

Post by dntrkv »

metadat wrote: post #621
slaymaker1907 wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think six months is a pretty unreasonable time frame for Apple. While the security concerns around this sort of thing are often overblown, Apple will need to rework their security model for the iPhone. If there is an API surface between the OS and the App Store, they may need to rework it since it's not been designed with third party stores in mind.

What timeline do you think the Gatekeepeers would prefer? Is it a reasonable goal to let BigTech drag it's feet making these changes they didn't want to do on their own accord in the first place? Amazing things are possible when the incentive is right. Given their VAST resources, it's only a matter of focus.

I don't know how anyone would think that timeline is in any way possible. Not gonna happen.
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