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EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

consilium.europa.eu

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Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#661

Post by 627467 »

whywhywhywhy wrote: post #414

I do wish iPhones could use alternate browser engines and bypass the Apple 30% cut, but the fact I'm having to click through one of those stupid cookie dialogs on this page just leaves the bad taste in my mouth of how much the EU regulation screwed up the internet the last time they made a change like this. Not saying I want tracking cookies everywhere, but they should have just made tracking cookies illegal outright…

I left Europe before the full enforcement of this cookies dialog and everytime I spend time there I'm like: how can anyone accept this state of affairs

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#662

Post by Bilal_io »

wyldfire wrote: post #311
Gareth321 wrote: post #2

This is easily one of the most expansive Acts regarding computing devices passed in my lifetime. The summary is in the link. As an iPhone user, this will enable me to: * Install any software * Install any App Store and choose to make it default * Use third party payment providers and choose to make them default * Use any voice assistant and choose to make it default * User any browser and browser engine and choose to…

> Install any software Could we have something like F-droid on iOS? I guess that's Cydia now but could Cydia be installed without requiring jailbreaking?

The delicious irony if the Cydia devs come back with an official Cydia store.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#663

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

This is very good news. Finally iPhone users will be able to truly own their devices, not begging Apple's permission to install the app they need.

Now, I wonder, how would Apple try to spoil this? When they were ordered to allow third party payment services, they started insisting on racketeering their additional 30% Apple Tax directly from developers. Any ideas?

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#664

Post by Krasnol »

turbinerneiter wrote: post #200
brtkdotse wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a popular opinion around here, but the reason I like my iPhone is _because_ it’s a walled garden. It just works, reliably, without surprises, for years on end.

That's fine, just stay on the default settings then. This however isn't a reason for the rest of the world to accept this. And since the power in the market is highly concentrated and all of it is moving more and more in this direction, regulation enforces these alternative options now. All this does is regulate the power the provider of a product has over their customer. This does not ruin the walled garden for the…

> This however isn't a reason for the rest of the world to accept this.

I guess most of "the rest of the world" will still be hindered by the price tag.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#665

Post by cmckn »

slaymaker1907 wrote: post #610
Gareth321 wrote: post #2

This is easily one of the most expansive Acts regarding computing devices passed in my lifetime. The summary is in the link. As an iPhone user, this will enable me to: * Install any software * Install any App Store and choose to make it default * Use third party payment providers and choose to make them default * Use any voice assistant and choose to make it default * User any browser and browser engine and choose to…

I think six months is a pretty unreasonable time frame for Apple. While the security concerns around this sort of thing are often overblown, Apple will need to rework their security model for the iPhone. If there is an API surface between the OS and the App Store, they may need to rework it since it's not been designed with third party stores in mind.

I don't think it's realistic. One example:

> Make core messaging functionality interoperable. They lay out concrete examples like file transfer

Google, Apple, and Amazon are supposed to design, ratify, implement and ship a universal messaging standard in 6 months? This won't happen even if they skip the first two steps and use an existing standard.

Apple ships a new iOS version in September, when this timer is supposed to start. Are they supposed to upend their entire release cycle and ship these major changes to their OS by March?

I've used iPhones for years, and I'm totally down with these bullet points. But I think we can all chuckle at the timeline, given the scope of this.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#666

Post by sirsinsalot »

rvz wrote: post #61
Gareth321 wrote: post #2

This is easily one of the most expansive Acts regarding computing devices passed in my lifetime. The summary is in the link. As an iPhone user, this will enable me to: * Install any software * Install any App Store and choose to make it default * Use third party payment providers and choose to make them default * Use any voice assistant and choose to make it default * User any browser and browser engine and choose to…

Quoted post unavailable.

This is nonsense. Users would be free to stick to the Apple app-store and apps. What it means is those that wish to install from alternative locations, can.

Competition in the app store space is a good thing. Competition generally is a good thing. This is what it is about.

Scaremongering this kind of nonsense to suppose walled-garden ecosystems (that primarily benefit the gardener, not the plants) is a stretch.

It's the same with payments. Why should Apple not only dictate what software I can and can not use on my device, but also force those developers to use an officially sanctioned payment API so they can take a fat cut?

Congratulations to the EU indeed, for the right reasons.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#667

Post by justapassenger »

nuker wrote: post #613
justapassenger wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, and that unsecured Linux is destroying the world! It’s not about making products less secure. That’s what apple makes you wanna think. It’s about giving customers choice. They can stay in Apple ecosystem (I will for example). Or they can not. Companies like Apple will have to work much harder now, to give both users and developers enough value to justify being locked in.

> They can stay in Apple ecosystem Nope, Adobe will make sure all its apps require Adobe App Store. Same for Facebook with Whatsapp. No more stupid Apple store restrictions, yay!!

Would they? If 90% of users stay on apple App Store, they won’t.

It’s all about value they can provide, both sides.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#668

Post by koyote »

microtonal wrote: post #213
turbinerneiter wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fine, just stay on the default settings then. This however isn't a reason for the rest of the world to accept this. And since the power in the market is highly concentrated and all of it is moving more and more in this direction, regulation enforces these alternative options now. All this does is regulate the power the provider of a product has over their customer. This does not ruin the walled garden for the…

That's fine, just stay on the default settings then. I agree in principle, but I worry that we end up in the situation where if you need to use a particular app, you can only get it from a third-party store that you don't trust. (Something gross like Facebook starting an app store.) Or course, this is mostly a result of Apple being greedy. If they had acted like a good steward of the platform rather than trying to ex…

> but I worry that we end up in the situation where if you need to use a particular app, you can only get it from a third-party store that you don't trust

I often hear this argument but Android has had third-party app-stores and 'side-loadable apps' since day one and I can't think of a single major app that needs its own app-store.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#669

Post by fariszr »

n8cpdx wrote: post #550
fariszr wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm also annoyed that the EU produces effectively 0 innovative tech, and subsequently has very suppressed tech salaries, but is so ready to regulate the American companies that make the world go 'round Because its almost impossible to compete? These companies have so many resources, its impossible for any local competitor to compete. Amazon can just crash the prices till the competition dies, Google can just not al…

The parent comment was being unfair. There is one market where Europeans dominate both in sheer volume and in innovation: excuses. Excusing business, excusing governments; an international pastime of the Europeans, apparently. Europeans did in fact exist before all of the listed examples came into being, and so could have outcompeted any of them even if they are now dominant. But I still think Europeans _could_ compe…

> Europeans who know their markets better could compete if they wanted to

This is not realistic.

When amazon noticed diapers.com, they were basically forced to sell out. because amazon was already selling diapers at a loss and was ready to drive the price "down to zero".

No body can compete with that.

https://slate.com/technology/2013/10/amazon-book-how-jeff-be...

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#670

Post by koyote »

smileybarry wrote: post #558
fyzix wrote: post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook isn't forcing Android users to install their apps from an alt store so that point is moot

If you're browsing the web version of Facebook, the banner to install their app links directly to an APK, not Google Play. "Better with the app" shows in a bunch of places alongside a "accidentally broken" suggestion bar whose "X" doesn't work. Messenger refuses to work on the web and requires you to download the app, unless you pretend to be a desktop browser. Source: I refused to install Facebook's app while on And…

> If you're browsing the web version of Facebook, the banner to install their app links directly to an APK, not Google Play.

Can you please show me how you managed to make this happen? I just browsed to Facebook and the top banner takes me to the Play store.

I would be VERY surprised if facebook forced users to go into the special apps access settings page and enable installing apks. That's a power user feature.

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