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Twitter Layoff Started Today

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Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#191

Post by pvarangot »

cecilpl2 wrote: post #82
whatgoodisaroad wrote: post #68

My understanding was that this sort of stock sale blackout is typically an internal thing to avoid insider trading liability, but if you've been laid off, you would no longer be internal and therefore no longer subject to the blackout. Is that not how it's structured here?

You are subject to a blackout when you have material nonpublic information. IME the blackout remains until the opening of the trading window following the end of your employment.

> You are subject to a blackout when you have material nonpublic information.

Kinda legally yes, but some mid-sized companies enforce a trading blackout by contract and with a broker-level feature on everyone just so that they don't have to do the work of telling everyone that has that kind of information that they do. Twitter probably does this because of how the LinkedIn thing is worded.

The former employees could transfer their shares to another broker and sell them with no issue if they think they are on the good side of the law, which they probably will be after severance.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#192

Post by Disruptive_Dave »

projectazorian wrote: post #162
falcolas wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's pretend some of these SF twitter employees have families. $4k in rent monthly, 4k in general living expenses (these are based off median figures available publicly) A bit over $96k in living costs. Assuming that $200k in total comp includes about 25% in stock (based off publicly reported comp packages for twitter employees), and a combined state/federal 35% tax rate... They have no spare money to save without a…

It's a sad commentary that when the prospect of someone facing economic hardship comes up, many peoples' first thought is "but did they deserve it?"

Wouldn't it be naive to ignore context and imprudent to dismiss lessons available in this time? You can have compassion for someone AND attempt to help them learn from struggles and correct poor choices.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#194

Post by seoaeu »

vlozko wrote: post #123
skookum wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are trading blackout windows enforced in any way other than threat of dismissal? I don't think there's any external repercussions to trading during an applicable blackout, and trading on NPMI is illegal regardless of whether it is done in or out of a window.

Usually the broker that handles RSUs for the company automatically does this. They’ll prevent you from doing such trades. You could still technically use a different broker and buy/sell but that’s probably blatant insider trading.

> that’s probably blatant insider trading.

It is only insider trading if you are basing your trades on insider information. If your only reason for selling is “I just got laid off and need the cash” then you should be fine

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#195

Post by jpollock »

penneyd wrote: post #132
jpollock wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people are extended enough that their stock is considered part of their compensation for buying a house. I know many people that sell all of their stock every month to make sure they have enough to live in the Bay Area. What's the mortgage on a USD$2m 1300sqft house? Looks to be $11k/mo? So, total comp should be at least US$400k to be considered affordable. Using South Bay, I don't know where a Twitter engineer…

Plenty of spots in the East Bay that are way below your quoted hypotheticals.

Yes, you trade commute for $$, with every 10mins being worth about $7-10k (I think), and every "point" on the school rating being another $10-15k. The heat maps tend to be centered around Google, Apple and Facebook.

I live downtown San Jose, 90min commute/day, and paid $500-$600k less, but the school isn't anywhere near as good.

Parents have different perceptions of value and choose differently.

East Bay was never an option for me - can't commute by bike from there to Mountain View/Sunnyvale.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#196

Post by lbotos »

marcins wrote: post #166
TimPC wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly if you’re paying a mortgage at current rates, 6 months income is an excessive amount to hold out. Assuming that’s $100k, you’re paying somewhere around $5600/year by not paying down your mortgage more aggressively. I have a lot of sympathy for someone who’s plan for savings was “if I get fired I can”: (1) use my severance money (2) sell my stock (3) get a loan against my home Only blackout periods blocked (2…

Does the US not have Mortgage Offset Accounts? An offset account is essentially a normal transaction account tied to your mortgage, but every dollar in the account "offsets" the mortgage balance for daily interest calculations. My "emergency fund" is just in one of my offset accounts, so it's saving me on my mortgage interest.

Sounds like a "home equity line of credit"

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#197

Post by jpollock »

mathgladiator wrote: post #144
jpollock wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people are extended enough that their stock is considered part of their compensation for buying a house. I know many people that sell all of their stock every month to make sure they have enough to live in the Bay Area. What's the mortgage on a USD$2m 1300sqft house? Looks to be $11k/mo? So, total comp should be at least US$400k to be considered affordable. Using South Bay, I don't know where a Twitter engineer…

Holy shit, seems like bad personal finance. I never consider stock in my budget, how did this come to be?

People really want a house, and the banks allow it.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#198

Post by fleddr »

jmathai wrote: post #67
schnebbau wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess they'll have to lower their cost of living like the rest of us?

I don't understand the hate towards high cost of living areas. Making a few $100k in a HCOL area is similar to making $100k in a LCOL area. You don't live like a king if both your income AND expenses are higher. Both people in this example have a lot more in common than I'm reading into from your comments.

Well, I have news for you: 100K in a LCOL is a type of salary that pretty much nobody in the US, let alone the rest of the world earns. It's an elite salary. The absolute top tier for employees worldwide.

It's not hate, it's trying to get people to understand that they are elite and privileged.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#199

Post by solveit »

rocqua wrote: post #100
throwaway5959 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Equity isn’t an emergency fund.

As long as it has liquidity, why not. A volatile but oversized emergency fund is not horrible. Especially if the estimated chance of needing it is low.

It is horrible if the volatility has a high chance of coinciding with the emergency you're preparing for.

Worried about medical emergencies? Emergency fund in equities isn't terrible. But if your emergency fund is supposed to support you after getting laid off due to an economic downturn, your emergency fund is going to be a lot smaller than it was right before the emergency. And if your emergency fund is in the stock of the same company that you work at, you're opening yourself up to just not having an emergency fund in the worst-case scenario that your company outright goes under.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#200

Post by gwerbret »

> So- in addition to losing their jobs, which Twitter assured employees would not happen

I'm not that old, but even I remember a time when companies, at least in principle, would invest in their employees (via stable employment, regular raises, mutual trust) in return for employees investing in the companies (innovation, extra effort, dedication, championing the company brand). Today, we have this:

- Companies using the barest of excuses, or none at all, to lay off employees. Because it makes good business sense.

- Companies lying, deliberately and freely, to employees about upcoming layoffs, in order to "stave off panic". Because it makes good business sense.

- Companies laying employees off in the most impersonal fashions possible (large Zoom meetings, automated email, SMS). Because business sense, etc.

- Companies literally escorting laid-off employees out of the building like criminals, on the premise that a suddenly-former employee is an incipient criminal.

- Companies stiffing people on severance, based on a cost-benefit analysis which concludes that the potential legal bills will cost less than a fair and reasonable severance. Because, again, it makes good business sense.

In spite of the downsides of unions, this turn of affairs is really an argument in favor of universal unionization.

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