Earlier quoted context omitted.
very well written. thank you! two thoughts that came up: - your 3 Ps sounds like a lot like I imaging older generations (older than me, mid20). Do you think this is changing with newer generations? As you said, this all is pretty much bullshit... - From what OP said, she's more on the intellectual side. Men (or human in general) on this side might be more open and doesn't follow the cave man 'uga-uga' mentality
Thanks! To answer your ?s and speak to your comment: - Short answer: Probably never. The 3Ps theory is well established in academic masculinist studies. A good overview of the 3Ps comes from Gilmore's 1991 book Manhood in the Making: Cultural Concepts of Masculinity if you want to learn more. Very briefly, all males conform to these Ps to participate in male honor. Yes, many males do not, but they are then without ho…
Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
691–700 of 741 posts
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#692And no, that's not a typo.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#693Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why shouldn’t it be that I can have a strategic goal in my life to have kids and a family and work towards achieving that in an active, not passive way ? How’s that working out for you?
As desperate and defeated as my post does sound, actually rather well. When I stopped sitting in my room complaining about friends about how I was single, I started getting on dating apps. I enjoyed some lovely kisses, a few intimate moments and eventually met my first boyfriend. I haven't met my husband yet, but I've definitely experienced that I'm living IN the world and moving closer to what I want instead of stay…
Instead, you seem quite and transactional and check-list oriented.
Has there not been a man you’ve met for whom you’ve simply fallen head over heels in love? A man that suddenly makes all your strategic-thinking utterly irrelevant? I have no tips for how to find such a guy. But, I would bet that IF you find your soulmate, it will come out of the blue and, perhaps, he’ll meet very very few of your criteria. And, you won’t care in the slightest as you will have found in him a host of qualities that you suddenly realize you can’t live without.
Good luck.
Practical advice? Stay off the apps… I’ll risk the downvotes by saying the obvious: you don’t want the kind of guy who uses dating apps. You want the kind of guy you bump into in person, walking the dog.
In short, find a guy your attracted to, and flirt. It’s your superpower as a woman: regrettably, most women seem to have no idea how much control they have in finding a mate. Your last line about men being strategic in dating is wrong. We are not. Instead, most men are just waiting and hoping and praying that a woman will smile at them and start a flirtatious conversation.
*edit*I don’t think I was clear. Your problem isn’t getting dates… I get that. You probably know how to flirt quite well. I guess what I’m saying is that once you have the guy, make it romantic. Your superpower (more downvotes incoming) is your ability (and most women’s ability) to make a guy do whatever you want. Hell, many guys are dead-set against getting married… until I woman gets them to completely change their mind. It’s cliche in fact. You don’t need to find a guy who wants kids, in other words; you need only find a guy who wants to make you happy. Once you find that guy, you’re set— his pre-you opinions, goals, dreams, and sometimes even religion, is irrelevant at that point… we’re quite malleable, you know, and not nearly as set in our ways or strategic as you might think.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#694Earlier quoted context omitted.
All true. Maybe I should post this on your channel on Reddit:) I certainly don’t lead the first date with wanting to have kids unless people ask. But I’ve heard from several relationship experts to be sure values are aligned in the first couple dates. Fortunately, people usually specify this in dating apps so you can filter for people who don’t want kids. Funnily enough, one of the biggest turn-offs I’ve experienced…
As a man not much younger than you, it's helpful to hear that's a turn-off. What to ask when is tricky. I see several options: 1. Estimate the odds of successfully procreating upfront; Downside: Can seem boorish and unromantic and ruin the chance of a potentially successful relationship. 2. Keep getting to know each other and discuss once we're more comfortable with each other. If the answer is unfavorable: a. Be hon…
What is not ok is inferring that they couldn’t have children because of their age or asking very pointed questions about their reproductive health on a first date, especially if they don’t want to volunteer that information to someone they barely know. Don’t you think it would be odd if a woman who you were ok a first date asked you about your sperm count and pressured you to reply if you weren’t able to volunteer that info immediately ?
The other thing is that I am clear about my age and desire to have children in my dating profile, so it’s upsetting to have someone second guess me on a first date…
If a woman is kind and compassionate and honest and not sure about her ability to have kids, when you’ve expressed a strong desire to have them, she’ll take the high road and tell you or leave the relationship.
If you are ready to get more serious with someone and have trust and intimacy built up, it is totally ok to have that conversation.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#695Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#696Maybe it's time for an "Ask HN: Who's Single". I can't imagine there's only one person on here trying to find someone. If politics are occasionally allowed on here, maybe that would be, too.
The HN meetups are still happening, right?
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#697One of my ex-girlfriends had a list of twenty things she required in a mate. I met 19 of them. She left. I met an amazing woman a couple of years later (at 43). We’re married and have an amazing 13 yo daughter. My ex is still single. Maybe examine your standards. And I do mean this in a constructive way, by way of perhaps helping to troubleshoot. The way you describe your experience above, you present as high-expecta…
The first thing that I thought when I read the question is: why did those 120 dates not work out? I know there are plenty of terrible men out there, but there are also plenty of great ones. 120 should be plenty to find a good match, so why was the match not there? My wife is not perfect, and neither am I. We have our flaws, because everybody does. We're not the perfect mate the other would have designed if we had to…
The reason I didn’t go into it more is because when I wrote this post, I was more curious about discovering strategies or hacks others had personally used to find their partner, especially after initially failing.
This is one of the most foreword-thinking, creating online communities solving some of the worlds biggest problems on a global scale. I felt that my post sounded desperate and I was prepared for trolls. But I felt it was worth it to expose myself in this deeply personal way in order to gather insights on problem-solving , specifically love hacks , from such brilliant minds.
I am not the only person with this problem and so I wanted to approach this community of highly creative problem solvers to see if they’d found any solutions I hadn’t thought of.
And then to determine myself if this solution could work for me.
Hearing about people’s personal experiences and from some of the data scientists who have weighed in, has been invaluable. And for that, I am so grateful.
In the beginning of the conversation, I felt that this was the tone: people were giving advice based on their own experiences or from their perspective as programmers and data scientists.
However, as the conversation went on, I felt it became more and more about people analyzing my personal psychology. And people became increasingly insistent I offer up the reasons I did not go on second dates with some people. I felt almost that I was on trial for poor discernment in who I was attracted to or not. Or even, for not being attracted to a particular person, as if that was somehow malevolent on my part.
I’m terms of my personal psychology, I already feel I have support in that area. I have licensed professionals, a therapist, two highly experienced spiritual teachers and very good friends and blunt family members who give me honest, though not always easy to hear feedback.
And I’m far from perfect. As you all saw, while I started answering people graciously, as I got more fatigued , I started to become less gracious, less clear, lost my temper and even spoke to people and about people in a way that was extremely arrogant, dismissive and rude. When I’m tired, I sometimes have a short fuse, and I’m sorry.
(To be clear, I have had overwhelming crushes on men of all shapes and sizes, lots of lovely hair and beautiful smooth heads. You are all handsome in your way.)
When I posted, I was not looking for a deep analysis of my personal psychology or character. And I believe I am not obligated to answer questions about that to a group of strangers.
It did feel a little uncomfortable when people started asking, then if felt, almost demanding, and at times accusing me for why I chose not to go on second dates with 90% of the men I met online.
Certainly, I’ve wondered many times if I’m too selective. And in fact, when I first started dating in my early thirties, I believe I was focused on the wrong things. Since then, I’ve learned that one can really grow to love someone even if there isn’t a spark in the first date - and it’s far better to focus on qualities rather than materialistic things like looks or job.
During my most recent round of dating, I kept a log of every single date I went on. I chose an accountability partner who is cutthroat honest who I told about every experience and why I didn’t want to go on a second date. If she felt the reason was bad, I gave the person another try.
The other reason I did not feel I wanted to share why I didn’t go on second dates, is because I don’t like to disparage others. (Yes, I know it happened in my comments) This post is about my experience, not the men I went out with, who I know will make some woman very happy one day.
Among the reasons I did not go on second dates include sexual harassment, insults, extreme religious views, being rude to a homeless person, overconsumption of alcohol, drug addiction and yes, occasionally bad breath, maybe not fair but it happens. Sometimes, I just wasn’t at all attracted to the person.
I hope this explains my reluctance to not justify the specific reasons I did not go on second dates and I once again thank everyone who weighed in - especially those of you who did volunteer some great, scaleable love hacks :)
Together, through our creative minds and the power of technology, I believe we can solve any problem in the world.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#698Earlier quoted context omitted.
The first thing that I thought when I read the question is: why did those 120 dates not work out? I know there are plenty of terrible men out there, but there are also plenty of great ones. 120 should be plenty to find a good match, so why was the match not there? My wife is not perfect, and neither am I. We have our flaws, because everybody does. We're not the perfect mate the other would have designed if we had to…
This is a really good question and one people asked me over and over. The reason I didn’t go into it more is because when I wrote this post, I was more curious about discovering strategies or hacks others had personally used to find their partner, especially after initially failing. This is one of the most foreword-thinking, creating online communities solving some of the worlds biggest problems on a global scale. I…
I understand why you wanted the focus to be more generic. That's not how I or most other problem solvers I know approach solving problems. Certainly, one could write out a general theory of optimal mate selection that you would be able to apply to yourself without further back and forth. Crafting such a theory is several orders of magnitude more difficult than searching for a potential improvement in a given implementation.
With the disclaimer that I can't speak for others, I suggest that figuring out your rejection function isn't about deciding whether a given decision is good or bad and most certainly isn't an attempt to tell you who you should be attracted to.
There are a few intellectually interesting puzzles it presents: 1. Given some sense of what appeals to actfrench, where is she likely to find more such people? //You provided enough information to give a sense of this 2. Is there a discernible reason that the men she tends to accept tend to reject her? //I have a hypothesis but this is less clear 3. Is there some fundamental conflict between different aspects of what she likes? //Again, less clear 4. Are there reasons to filter someone out earlier in the process? //Again, maybe but unclear
As you note, you have no obligation to deal with any of this. But since you came back after a few days and decided to invest your energy in this, I'm giving you the perspective of one of those guilty of the aforementioned sin on why your psyche seems like a crucial part of solving the puzzle.
Ultimately dating is optimizing three things: 1. The utility of members of the candidate stream: P(Match) - Cost of discovery 2. The quality of rejection function which is a function of both information collected and discriminatory power 3. The probability that the candidate one most wants, wants you back
Anyway, yes, we can solve any problem in the world. One of us has to decide to build a new type of matching experience. I've toyed with doing so as I'm sure dozens of others here have. Sadly, the main constraint is time. Do we fix dating or healthcare or politics or education or just keep our little slice of industry functioning smoothly in exchange for the resources to live.
It will be solved. When and by whom remains unknown. In the meantime, cheers to special casing the problem and decrementing the target market size by one.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#699I've met many women like you who seem great on paper, but ultimately pass. Because qualifications don't matter as much as how someone makes me feel. If I could crack my own code I would optimize my search. But I seriously cannot..
Surely in the past decade of your life a man has been super interested but you felt 6/10 about them. Maybe commit and work on turning 6/10 feelings into an 8/10 and call yourself lucky.
Re: Ask HN: I’m 41 and still unmarried – what should I do?
#700Some ideas worth exploring. 1. Find a guy from a set that's undervalued. For example: 20-something shy nerd that's inexperienced with women, and doesn't have a lot of self confidence. In 10 years, they would probably be a "catch" but caught by someone else then. Think grad/law/med student at highly competitive technical university. For example, read about Scott Aaronson's early adult years https://www.theatlantic.com…
> Cosmetic surgery. Be brutally honest on what can take you from, say, an 8 to a 9. Guys like certain physical attributes, and in general may get you more attention even outside of a dating app. This way lies madness. Do not do this. Seriously, screw those guys who are not interested in you at your current attractiveness level (whatever it may be). If cosmetic surgery moves you up one notch on a 1-10 scale and that i…