181–190 of 356 posts
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Well I don't want styling just document structure/description (eg. H1-8, Title, EM, P, IMG, Author, Article, Forum-Post, Search-Result) and yes I want images too so Gemini goes way too far my uses.
Images complicate the accessible requirement.
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Yes but before the tech community was all fire for Firefox. IT-guys installed it on work computers, school computers etc. We would recommend it to our families and install it for our less techy family when they would need our assistance. Firefox had the IT-sector with them. I think this does a lot for spreading the usage. Even just one IT-guy can probably give Firefox hundreds of users. Now, this is no longer the cas…
Given the direction Brendan Eich has pursued at Brave, I'm personally very glad he didn't remain as Mozilla's CEO, regardless of political views. Edit: Also, I don't think it's particularly reasonable to single out an individual being funded by Mozilla without a very good explanation as to why. Is there something that Leil Zahra has done which makes you think they are inappropriate to be associated with Mozilla? Or a…
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It's like confusing "open-source" Android, AOSP and Play Services: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/07/googles-iron-grip-on... >While Android is open, it's more of a "look but don't touch" kind of open. You're allowed to contribute to Android and allowed to use it for little hobbies, but in nearly every area, the deck is stacked against anyone trying to use Android without Google's blessing. The second you try to…
The difference is, AOSP on its own is unusable, but Chromium Is.
I’m a little surprised why Chinese firms aren’t coming in and competing? Maybe they think web is not important for their future anymore?
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Personally, I think Google already does whatever it wants similar to what Microsoft did. They do offer standards for discussion but it will implemented and expect other vendors to follow suit.
> They do offer standards for discussion but it will implemented and expect other vendors to follow suit. Safari definitely does not just follow suit (see https://caniuse.com/?compare=chrome+102,safari+15.5&compareC... for example).
The chromium-only web is not google’s fault. It is a symptom of a body of web standards that has grown wild to the point of being all but unimplementable. Building a browser for the modern standards-based web is effectively impossible, because it costs too much, takes too long, and requires a standing army to keep up with. We are at an impasse. The standards cannot be deprecated because they are used all over the web…
> Building a browser for the modern standards-based web is effectively impossible, because it costs too much, takes too long, and requires a standing army to keep up with.
> We are at an impasse. The standards cannot be deprecated because they are used all over the web, and because they are used all over the web a new browser maker has little choice except forking chromium or firefox.
the browser just becomes an execution engine, the current "web stack" becomes a (cacheable) downloadable library, meanwhile other languages, ui frameworks etc can flourish in the browser (now a much more simple thing that anyone can implement)
maybe just pie-in-the-sky?
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Brave and Vivaldi fall into the “don’t matter” category. Call me when a Chromium fork displaces Chromium.
If your argument is based purely on market share then it's basically a tautology.
You wrote:
> The fact that both Brave and Vivaldi were able to disable Google's FlOC within a very short period of time
Okay, they disabled some stuff. That isn’t a fundamental divergence from the upstream project.
The original argument was that Google wouldn’t control the web in a Chromium monoculture because anybody can just fork it.
I disagree. My argument has two prongs:
1. A Chromium fork can only sever itself from Google’s control if it is not taking patches from upstream (ie, Google). I’m particularly thinking about the most consequential pieces: web APIs, not Google ad tech. That’s going to require an army of developers who now are immediately thrust onto the web API treadmill.
2. If a Chromium fork’s market share is tiny, how is it going to displace Google’s influence on the direction of the web? It isn’t. Everybody will still be coding against Google’s Chromium.
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The point is they can make the forks useless, unless sufficiently many users choose to use forks, which isn't a very likely scenario.
They can make some specific features of any forks useless, not all of them as the FlOC situation has demonstrated. But the same is true for features of alternative browser engines that don't gain enough market share.
These sorts of arguments probably help cement Google’s power. By giving the guise that the open source part of the equation can be the key to usurping Google’s power. Instead of it mostly being the other way around.
It would not be surprising if Google loves these tiny changes from Chrome and Android. So the discussions and sentiment never get close to how bad it got for IE or other monopolies and dangers of power.
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>My point is that Open Source of itself is not sufficient And I didn't claim that it was. My point was merely that Chromium being open source changes the equation pretty fundamentally compared to the IE situation. Whether it's enough to make a Chromium monopoly consistent with an open web, I really don't know. There are very good reasons to be sceptical.
Your comments appear to be saying that Chromium being open source makes the equation better. Like the comments defending this point about Brave and other wrapper browsers. So you’re not claiming open source is sufficient but you are seemingly defending it is a better situation. While I and some other commenters are signaling we don’t think the situation is better. To me the fundamental part of the equation is outsize…
Yes, that's exactly right. I think Chromium being open source changes the equation for the better compared to the IE situation. Whether it is sufficiently better to make it work, I'm not sure. I do see Google's outsized influence as a significant problem. I'm not denying that at all.
The fact that browsers like Brave have made changes that go against Google's interests is cause for some optimism though.