391–400 of 448 posts
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Agreed- couldn’t figure out what was going on… finally checked here and - ah now I can sleep
Cloudflare going down is one of the things which keeps me awake, My main complaint about Cloudflare is that they are very good at everything they offer that we've become reliant on them for everything.
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"do no evil" springs to mind -- once burned, etc.
Yeah, What's up with the competition to Cloudflare? What's the real barrier for entry? It's not infrastructure anymore, As there is a new PaaS startup every week offering distributed hosting and So why bundling in DNS, DDOS detection+mitigation, cloud workers... with it is so hard?
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economies_of_scale
As Cloudflare gets bigger, they can provide services more cheaply. This is because (a) they can more fully utilise their data centres and other physical capital investments, (b) they can divide their fixed software costs over more users and (c) they get process efficiencies and discounts with scale.
A new entrant will struggle to match cost unless they're able to obtain similar scale. The bigger Cloudflare gets, the bigger the scale that a new entrant needs to hit before they can match them on cost.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect
Second they're aiming to build a network effect through having huge number of locations. The more locations, the more appealing to new customers as they can be close to more users. A competitor will have to build a similar number of locations to match Cloudflare's proposition.
A new entrant cannot provide as much value, and therefore cannot charge as high a price, without building a similar sized network. This again requires the entrant to invest heavily before they can charge a similar price.
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The combination of these two things mean that when Cloudflare is operating at a large scale with a large network it can offer a more valuable service (and charge a higher price) than a new entrant, and earn more profit because it can operate at a lower cost.
Also, Cloudflare has the option of lowering its price and still being profitable due to lower costs at its scale, so it can deter entrants from trying to compete by the threat of being able to lower prices below what is profitable for new entrants.
The only players who can compete may be those who already have comparable size - Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Facebook, CDNs, etc, since they will already have addressed the issues of scale and network effects. However, they may not want to cannibalise their existing markets. It will be hard for other new entrants to compete.
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I'm not sure you and your parent understand what an SLA means. It's an agreement that, when broken, incurs a penalty. They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime. They're saying they'll pay you for any downtime. It's literally the 3rd paragraph: > 1.2 Penalties. If the Service fails to meet the above service level, the Customer will receive a credit equal to the result of the Service Credit calculation in Section 6…
> They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime > Cloudflare ("Company") commits to provide a level of service for Business Customers demonstrating: [...] 100% Uptime. The Service will serve Customer Content 100% of the time without qualification. This is a legal commitment to provide 100% uptime. They are guaranteeing 100% uptime and defining penalties for failing to meet that guarantee. The fact that a penalty is d…
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I'm not sure you and your parent understand what an SLA means. It's an agreement that, when broken, incurs a penalty. They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime. They're saying they'll pay you for any downtime. It's literally the 3rd paragraph: > 1.2 Penalties. If the Service fails to meet the above service level, the Customer will receive a credit equal to the result of the Service Credit calculation in Section 6…
> They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime > Cloudflare ("Company") commits to provide a level of service for Business Customers demonstrating: [...] 100% Uptime. The Service will serve Customer Content 100% of the time without qualification. This is a legal commitment to provide 100% uptime. They are guaranteeing 100% uptime and defining penalties for failing to meet that guarantee. The fact that a penalty is d…
"Service Credits are Customer’s sole and exclusive remedy for any violation of this SLA."
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My company uses 3 CDNs, although not cloudflare. If one (say Aakami) goes down it gets removed from the pool and life continues.
Well that makes your company more responsible than my credit union.
How that SLA measures a 2 second outage for some customers is a separate thing, and sort of shows how meaningless these things can be on the internet (if you lose service for 10% of your potential customers is that an outage? How about 90%? How do you know how many were lost).
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CF SRE team need to rethink their published SLA of 100%. This is not reasonable. https://www.cloudflare.com/business-sla/
An SLA of 100% simply means you agree to compensate your customers (as specified, usually with credit) if your service is down at all, nothing more. Also, SRE here but not for Cloudflare -- I've never seen SREs directly involved in externally published SLAs, they usually come from legal. We deal with SLOs on more fine grained SLIs than overall uptime
I made it to SLA (which I believe stands for service level agreement). What do the other abbreviations stand for?
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Wouldn't this expose the origin IPs to attack?
Yes, but I'd wager that most sites experience cloudflare outages more often than they experience bona fide attacks.
DDoS attacks are extremely common at just about any scale, even if you only have a few thousand users.
Cloudflare going down like this? Actually first time I remember it happening. There’s been downtime before but nothing so major.
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Your box running your web server is far less complicated than using a CDN and worrying about countless additional points of failure. Network problems are only a minor risk.
And where will I host my box? I'm my apartment? My Internet goes down at least twice a year and my electricity goes down even more, specially in the winter. So no, this is not more reliable than cloudflare.
You seem to imply that the options are only cloudflare or your apartment. This simply isn't true: there are a plethora of companies that will lease you a dedicated box of some Us in one of their racks, as the sibling commenter replies. Alternatively, you can search for co-location services. Options range from 1U/2U co-location, to half rack units, to full racks, to dedicated areas of the datacentre ranging from cages to whole rooms (I've been in at least one datacentre where an entire room was under separate access control and leased to one customer only).
Usually datacentres are located quite strategically. For example the location of many datacentres in Zürich corresponds with two separate power supply grids that meet (so they can pull from both).
Some of the companies involved are resellers and don't actually operate the datacentres they use. Others actually do. Usually the service is more or less the same, from the point of view of renting a 1U, or co-locating one.
If you want reliability features of a datacentre, e.g. for your office services, but might move, you may find your local city surprising. In Manchester, UK, there's a large amount of dark fibre under the city (fibre that is laid, but not in use), owned by some of the DC companies. Sometimes you can connect your office to said datacentre via dedicated fibre.
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An SLA of 100% simply means you agree to compensate your customers (as specified, usually with credit) if your service is down at all, nothing more. Also, SRE here but not for Cloudflare -- I've never seen SREs directly involved in externally published SLAs, they usually come from legal. We deal with SLOs on more fine grained SLIs than overall uptime
> SLA […] SRE […] SLOs […] SLIs I made it to SLA (which I believe stands for service level agreement). What do the other abbreviations stand for?
SLO - Service Level Objective - the service level you strive for. If it's higher you have room for experimentation, etc.
SLI - Service Level Indicator - the actual metric(s) you use to measure a service level (latency, error rate, throughput, etc.)
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I'm not sure you and your parent understand what an SLA means. It's an agreement that, when broken, incurs a penalty. They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime. They're saying they'll pay you for any downtime. It's literally the 3rd paragraph: > 1.2 Penalties. If the Service fails to meet the above service level, the Customer will receive a credit equal to the result of the Service Credit calculation in Section 6…
> They aren't saying they guarantee 100% uptime > Cloudflare ("Company") commits to provide a level of service for Business Customers demonstrating: [...] 100% Uptime. The Service will serve Customer Content 100% of the time without qualification. This is a legal commitment to provide 100% uptime. They are guaranteeing 100% uptime and defining penalties for failing to meet that guarantee. The fact that a penalty is d…
I don't think you know what a guarantee is.
For example when you buy a new car you get a guarantee that it won't break down. Are they claiming it won't break down? No, of course not. What a guarantee means is that they'll fix it or compensate you if it does.