Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who are these bosses? Managers? You realize they’re just employees too right?
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Sure, it’s just like slavery. Except the part where you get paid and you can leave anytime you want.
Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
111–120 of 381 posts
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who are these bosses? Managers? You realize they’re just employees too right?
I do realize that, at least if we're talking about middle managers. It'd be a stretch to say that executives are "labor" or are "employees" except in a strict legal fashion. Executives don't work for companies; companies work for executives. The reasons for this are sociological rather than economic--in short, so long as executives uphold the interests of the upper class, the other rich people who control the company…
> Almost everyone who is and remains rich or powerful in this world is a crook
That’s an opinion.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If a person has enough to survive, why would they toil and labour? Just do whatever you like! It really boils down on how many people need how much resources and how many people produce these resources. You can argue over who should be your bourgeoisie, should it be the political elite or the entrepreneurs or should it be inherited or or should it be the the people from special blood or religion or should no one be…
Humanity is much more productive per capita than 50 years ago, but we are collectively working more hours, not less. The goal should not be for everyone to do no work. The goal should not be for everyone to work full time and fear unemployment.
If your boss is gonna take as much labor out of you as possible, no matter how productive you are, and no matter what advances in production methods you have achieved, productivity doesn't matter so much.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
Quoted post unavailable.
Sure, it’s just like slavery. Except the part where you get paid and you can leave anytime you want.
It's a more inclusive version of the company store where one does work for tokens while it's near impractical to be self sufficient & difficult/dangerous to be physically soverign. Even if one lives off the land, the corporations & government groups have polluted & own most of it. One would have to go fully indigenous to move away from the system, but even then there is much violence against the indigenous peoples.
Some solutions include gaining leverage over existing systems of control (e.g. management), cooperation with like minded people to form a group for protection (like a prison gang), carving out domains of autonomy from systems of control, or just stop feeding the more oppressive patterns in all aspects of life
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#115I am amazed at the disdain for leisure and "free" time and "slacking" in the comments here. If a person has enough to survive, why would they toil and labour? Just do whatever you like! I suspect a big problem is that many people actually don't know what they like to do. Most people with full-time jobs I know don't have much energy left after their workday, and thus the only "leisure" they are still capable of and th…
As I’ve gotten older, I have been vocalizing a question to my friends and family: why is it so unreasonable of me to not want to work a job I don’t like, and instead spend my time producing documentaries and teaching audio production to kids? These are two things I’ve found I love doing. They provide value to society. Yet a sustained income from them is basically unattainable except in very specific, lucky cases, not…
Has it occurred to you that the lack of people willing to pay for what you're trying to offer may be indicative that it's not quite as valuable as you perceive it to be?
I don't think it's work specifically that's tied to morality, but production. If someone is obviously consuming more than they're producing, then they're going to get negative attention. In 2022 it's not always clear exactly how much someone is producing, so it's generally assumed that someone with a full time job produces enough to cover their needs while the unemployed surviving off of welfare do not.
We even make allowances for people trying to reach net positive production. Students, for example, aren't typically looked down upon. It's only people who are actually lazy and not doing anything useful with their lives that are looked down upon, and rightfully so.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
>If I could get 1/10 of what I earn but without having to perform all this theatre, it would be better for everyone. What does this mean? You would take a 90% pay cut for 90% less work? Seems pretty doable
Not really, no company hires you for 10 or 20% in software engineering, while still paying enough that you could sustain yourself. The minimum is 80%, because it still the most of your time, so it seems reasonable in the work oriented society.
>no company hires you for 10 or 20% in software engineering, while still paying enough that you could sustain yourself.
I agree that most employers wont offer 10% positions, but my feeling is that someone can work 10-20% for 10% pay by gigging pretty easily.
Whether 10% pay is sustainable is a different question, but I was under the impression that you thought it was.
If you are looking for 10% work and 50% pay, I agree that is much less attainable.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#117Earlier quoted context omitted.
Probably everyone here can make low six figures without trying. But many want to make 400k a year. So they are trying. I'm done with the rat race myself. Physically, I'm in better shape than almost all of the try hards at work.
USA != world I can’t easily make six figures, nor can SWEs in many other places of the world. With that said, I do enjoy more leisure (4 day workweek). I know that’s a privilege as well. Greetings from Europe
I live in the USA and I don't know WTF he's talking about.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#118Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sure, it’s just like slavery. Except the part where you get paid and you can leave anytime you want.
It's a more inclusive version of the company store where one does work for tokens while it's near impractical to be self sufficient & difficult/dangerous to be physically soverign. Even if one lives off the land, the corporations & government groups have polluted & own most of it. One would have to go fully indigenous to move away from the system, but even then there is much violence against the indigenous peoples. S…
It was never practical to be self sufficient. Hunter gatherers living off the land worked together in tribes. People alone in the wilderness mostly die.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#119I am amazed at the disdain for leisure and "free" time and "slacking" in the comments here. If a person has enough to survive, why would they toil and labour? Just do whatever you like! I suspect a big problem is that many people actually don't know what they like to do. Most people with full-time jobs I know don't have much energy left after their workday, and thus the only "leisure" they are still capable of and th…
Its like the joke of the businessman who sees a fisherman doing nothing on the beach.
Why dont you go fish some more?
Why would i?
Then you can make more money, buy another boat and make even more money.
But why?
Then you can build a fleet and with even more money you can control the factories where your fish is processed.
And then?
Well then with your empire you can spend two weeks of the year on the beach, like me.
/short version.
Re: Experts once predicted that Americans would face excess leisure time (2015)
#120People do have excess free time. How else can you manage to waste 4+ hours on streaming and social media per day?
I think some of that is not 'free' but 'recharge' time. If you're so exhausted that all you can do is stare at a screen then you're not doing what you really want.
Unless that time isn't really as recharging as you think. I found out it wasn't for me.
I discovered that going for a run, doing a physical project, and socializing took more effort to start, but was vastly more relaxing and recharging.