I've always thought Lonscotdonland would be a great distributed city-state if we could secede with them. Both similar politics, fed up of what the rest of England is doing.
Scotland starts renewed case for independence
81–90 of 745 posts
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#82One quite important issue is the border. English and Scottish people will almost certainly never tolerate any kind of friction at that border. We've been moving across it seamlessly for centuries, families are mixed, businesses straddle the border, etc. If the Northern Ireland debacle has shown us anything, it's if Scotland were to leave and then join the EU that border would become an absolute political nightmare. T…
Another way to look at the Northern Ireland precedent, is that a compromise was found. People could argue that the same text can be reused.
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
Will you feel the same way when the EU seeks the end of veto powers (as is currently happening)? https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/european-parliament-a...
Which is going to get introduced because nations like Hungary, led by oil oligarchs connected to Russia, want to fk over whole EU for their personal gain. You should work towards stronger union not weaken it.
I am a Czech citizen and a mild Euroskeptic. I definitely do not want the EU to become stronger than it already is. We have had enough experience where obsession with "more power" leads, and I do not want to see this scenario replayed again in slightly different conditions.
What I value about current EU is precisely that it cannot just squash dissent by force, even from a single country.
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#84Earlier quoted context omitted.
I am not British or Scottish and have no skin in the game, but what is the harm in revoting if things seem to have changed? Either things didn’t change and everyone votes the same anyway, in which case it was a waste of time but reconfirms the status quo, or things actually are different and then you know and can act on it. Is there a special history or feature in UK democracy where things are only ever voted on one…
How often do you think independence referenda should be held?
When it’s a close vote and circumstances are changing rapidly, I’d say pretty often. Maybe every two or three years until some kind of consensus emerges? It seems like an important topic you wouldn’t want to suppress except for once every sixty years or whatever, and might force some negotiation to get to a better place whether through independence or reconciliation.
This is assuming the role of the government here is to track what the people want and execute their will. Maybe it’s different in the UK (again, I don’t live there and I know it’s a complicated system).
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because fracturing your country and making it poorer and smaller probably isn’t desirable?
A non Yugoslavian, I regret the breakup of Yugoslavia immensely but I do wonder if any of the former constituent states would agree with you regarding Scotland or me regarding Yugoslavia? Note that it's an open question if the Scots economy would remain worse per capita, not disagreeing there is/was pain ahead in transition.
IMO the collapse of Yugoslavia has mostly made the newly-independent states doomed to be forever at the periphery of capital.
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#86I don't see it happening, we've been through far too much in the last 10 years to inflict even more damage. I've asked this question many times but how is it feasible for Scotland to become Independent: 1. They currently don't meet the requirements to join the EU. Are they going to skip the current waiting list? 2. How will they create a military? 3. Still a big question mark over currency and Scotland's debt. 4. Own…
Perhaps I simply don't understand what you mean, but none of those questions seem very complex? For 1-3, see any Baltic states in the early 90s who are now a part of the EU. Just because you don't meet the requirements to join right away doesn't mean you can't do it over time. As for 4, naturally Scotland would own its own natural resources, what's ambiguous about that?
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#87With hard headed view, I struggle to see that an independent Scotland will be economically able to deal with large cuts to public sector spending that would almost certainly be required. Per capita spending is already higher in Scotland than in the rest of the UK. Scottish companies have debts denominated in pounds. There would almost certainly be capital flight to rUK. Large businesses may relocate. There is no plan…
Would it not be appealing for the English financial sector to move to Scotland if it’s part of the EU?
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Perhaps the fringe far-right parties have all but disintegrated, but the Tories have certainly drifted rightward and they're essentially untouchable in England in spite of ... well, everything
That's my point. UKIP and BXP disintegrated because their more competent members colonized the Conservative Party, which is now much more radical and far-right than it was under Cameron. The only surviving cabinet minister from Cameron's era (2010-2016) is Michael Gove. The rest are all new faces with far right credentials and a commitment to the hardest of hard Brexits.
> new faces with far right credentials
I'm not sure what your definition of far right is but that statement is quite far from the truth.
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
As a Dutch and EU citizen I fully understand their motivation. I also regretted to see England leave the EU.
Will you feel the same way when the EU seeks the end of veto powers (as is currently happening)? https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/european-parliament-a...
Not OP but also Dutch. Yes I would definitely like the EU to abolish veto powers and move to a majority rule. Europeans are too divided and need to band together to form a realistic opposition to the US and China. Veto rule is no way to govern a large group, since you only have to bribe a single member to cripple the whole. This has been known since at least the ancient Greek citystate era.
Re: Scotland starts renewed case for independence
#90As a Brit that didn’t want Scotland to be independent last time around: good luck to them. Brexit has shown very clearly that Scotland wants to chart a different path to England and IMO they should be allowed to do it. …just be generous to English folks seeking asylum from Tory rule, yeah?
For non-UK people: There are four nations in the UK (England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland). But England has roughly 90% of the population of the UK. So what England votes for in an all-nations referendum, the rest of the UK gets. England voted for Brexit by a narrow-ish majority. But Scotland voted against Brexit by a huge margin -- 62/38, or approximately 3:2. Ironically, the year before the Brexit referendum…
If Scottish leave voters hadn't turned out then the referendum would have resulted in "remain". So it's interesting to say in that context that "Scotland voted to remain" as many people simplify it to. 3:2 is a big margin and it's meaningful, but it doesn't define Scots.