Live data from Hacker News

Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

codinghorror.com

81–90 of 175 posts

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#82
"Having a child is a lot like running a marathon. An incredible challenge, but a worthwhile and transformative experience."

Yes, except it never ends.

My elderly father's last conversations were filled with concerns about my siblings. The more limited his mobility, the more exhausted he seemed, the more he worried about how they would get along.

I tell people that there are switches in the brain - that when you first hold your child (or any child should you hold it long enough), those switches turn on. You have no control of the switches; they are genetically-controlled hardware passed down from your parents. They have lain dormant for the several decades of your life, awaiting this moment. Once they turn on, they will not turn off.

The "switches" change your behavior radically: you will now react to the child's cry to sooth it, you will protect the child at all costs, you will grieve if it is harmed, etc.

Here's an example. One friend, an animal lover, upon entering her home with her first newborn instinctively commanded "Get the animals outside, all of them, outside, NOW!!" and to the bewilderment of all present, four previously beloved and sheltered pets were cast out into the frozen dark backyard (we did improvise shelter). To this day she remains amazed at what she did. The pets were allowed indoors 18 months later.

When I was young I didn't understand this. I was taught that we were tabulae rasae. Once I started to understand evolution, I saw that it only makes sense from an evolutionary perspective: what could be more important to a gene than producing another copy of related genes? What better way to do this than to program the organism to protect its young at all costs?

But there's another level of understanding: standing there, holding a child as the switches turn on. The experience itself.

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#83
post #11

So true that you can't explain to people. You can try, but they will either get the horror, or the bliss, but they'll never understand the strange and gut-bustingly hard mix of the two, and how quickly it swings from one to the other. When they are defying you and just threw food over the kitchen, you'll get grey hairs trying to fight the urge to blow your top. You'll say things you promised yourself you would never…

One thing that surprised me immensely was the unexpected new perspective and sense of respect for my own parents who had obviously been through it all themselves.

This hit me really hard when my daughter was born. My mother died when I was 14, and we were really close, but I didn't fully understand until my kid was born just how much she went through and put up with, fighting years of devastating illness and still being the most amazing mom on the planet. I wasn't prepared for it at all.

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#84
Way to go, Jeff! Congrats on twins!

I had twins born just over 10 years ago, and can clearly remember the doctor pulling up the ultrasound and circling a little dot and calling it a baby. There was another dot just like it on the other side of the screen, and I thought "this guy has no idea what he's doing", because he was missing the other dot.

Then he said, "here's another one". I said "another what?" He looked at me, and calmly replied, "there are two babies in here. You're having twins."

At that point, everything changed. Nobody believes me, but I bet you do. And everyone else on this thread who has kids gets it, too.

I had a boy and girl; the boy is named Henry. Small world, brother.

Keeping with the hacker theme, my kids are easily the best products I have ever shipped. :-)

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#85

Congrats to Jeff! My firstborn is also Henry, and I have two year old twin girls (Ada and Alice). The most interesting things about twins is how incredibly different they are from each other. They were nurtured in the same way, they share the same sets of genes, but they are wholly and fully their own people from day 1. It is completely fascinating stuff.

+oo.

(That's the best infinity symbol I can make.)

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#86
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the funny thing is, I remember them telling me "one day, if you have kids, you'll understand how this feels". I didn't take them seriously because I thought I knew everything. Now sort of understand what they meant. Now friends with older children keep telling me "little kids -- little problems, big kids -- big problems". I hear the words, but it doesn't really mean anything to me now, just a nice saying. But som…

My kid is a little sensitive. He was born prematurely and he also inherited a little allergic material from me. A month ago he had a very mild version of Lyell syndrome, most probably as an allergic reaction to an infection with staphylococcus aureus. He's over it, he's doing great in general, he looks his age both physically and mentally and to us he's the best kid in the world (and I'm sure we aren't exaggerating m…

I can't imagine how I would even handle that much stress and pressure.

I meant my comment to be more along the lines -- 'if you think crying and diaper changing is difficult, wait till you have to start worrying about them crashing your car, getting a call from the police when they are out with friends at night, or getting someone pregnant'.

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#87
post #45
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for commenting, because I can't understand the downvotes. I still don't see where I "publicly talk about my own family" in a "disgusting" way, but if that's how my comment comes across, it sure looks bad. For all it's worth, I love my kids. Of course. And I would throw myself under a bus for any of them. Of course. And I almost have, twice (under my motorbike, which is not a bus, but weights over 400 pounds).…

I didn't downvote you even if I could have, because it was clear to me where you were coming from (I disliked the article too, though for different reasons.) However, you (generally, not specifically you) would never say in front of your kids "well I love the first, but the others?" unless you're out of your mind. Imagine they'll dig down in the HN archives. It can have such a long-term harmful effect on their self-i…

Read again. He never said he loved the first one but not the others. I'm paraphrasing: "the first one is wonderful, the others not so much".

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#88
post #14

It is nice to see some positive words about having kids. But still what is so hard? Spending less time online? I have the impression that raising kids is much harder in the US.

You have less free time, in smaller increments, and no longer under your control. Let's say you have no children, and work a standard forty-hour week. I know that's not common here, but bear with me. The thing is, that other 108 hours per week is yours, and you can arrange it as you like. You can choose to work longer hours at a startup, or spend time on strenuous hobbies. You can choose to stay up late and sleep in…

This times 1000. While the article emphasizes the narrowly-won balance between love vs pain, this is a lot more realistic IMHO.

My wife and I have an 8-month old, and she's a reasonably 'easy baby'. But even so, from a coding perspective, the non-maskable interrupt thing is an absolute brain killer. And it's more difficult to get in the groove because of the sleep deprivation.

From what I see above, there's a lot of encouragement here that the instant love/bonding thing will make the whole experience worthwhile. That may be true. But there's also a lot of self-censorship (or even explicit censorship : search for the word 'disgusting') about how draining the whole thing can be. And that having a baby is not a choice that suits everyone : Think long and hard about whether you really want to give up two thirds of your usable free time...

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#89
post #13

Nicely written, although I have to say I don't find having a baby quite as horrible as most other parents seem to find it. Exhausting at times, yes, but nothing that gets me angry. As for my old life - maybe I wasn't partying hard enough, because I don't really miss it that much. OK, it is terrifying, but not because the kid is a terrorist. It is terrifying because life suddenly has you by the guts. I guess I cared a…

As I have learned, there is such a thing as easy babies and hard babies. I lotteried a hard one, and our friend landed an easy one. It's really unfair, but that's just how it goes. If you had an easy one, don't expect that all are equal if you ever decide to have another one. ;)

I've seen what you're talking about with easy vs. hard. We were lucky enough to have an easy baby. Yet I found the first few weeks very tough as I have higher than normal sleep requirements. By the end of week one I had trouble staying awake during the day, and was not able to return to normal functioning until a grandma came to help out for a couple weeks.

My son will be 7 in a few months. This age is way easier than the first few weeks . . . not hard at all really and filled with lots of fun times.

Re: Jeff Atwood On Parenthood

#90

This is not Parenting Magazine. I am a parent, but I came here to read about startups, technology and etc.. What happened?

There are people who want to have startups, deal with technology, AND be parents, too. There's no reason that they must be mutually exclusive. Besides, the number of articles regarding parenting on this site is a metaphorical drop in the ocean of tech articles.

I think it's wholly appropriate : To put up a warning flag around some of the major non-tech life events that the site's main demographic will be making decisions about.
Post reply on HN