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9-Euro-Ticket

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Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#101

Post by dx034 »

bowsamic wrote: post #46

I'm extremely not excited about how insanely rammed the public transportation is going to be for the next three months Already here in Hamburg the busses are not at all empty!

If there's such an uptick in demand it would show that price was what kept people from using public transport. In that case I'm sure there will be a lot of pressure to make travel more affordable.

So far, many claimed that a lack of availability was the reason public transport wasn't used more. I guess the next three months are a good way to validate that.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#102

Post by archi42 »

Tenoke wrote: post #42
archi42 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a matter of perspective. The ticket is not aimed solely at people with median income of a tech worker (or the typical HN crowd), but help out the general populace as a whole. Including those who can not even afford a car. Now I think when the times comes (3 month from now) for the program to run out, we might see discussions about continuing it at a price that makes it a more sustainable, permanent offer. But…

> more sustainable, permanent offer Seems pretty unlikely that they'll be able to after a 3 month period of operating at a loss (for the government) and likely having more issues due to increased usage.

My crystal ball is broken. I think there is a good chance that what you say will happen. But collecting the data in this nation-wide experiment is already quite useful when deciding on future policy. Until now it was always "we believe" or "this doesn't fit our agenda" or "this is socialism". Plus, if it is sufficiently popular and if the obstacles can be identified and overcome, then why not? If the new administration wants to reconnect with the people then employing some positive populism is quite nice.

//edit: As I said, I didn't mind paying for the mandatory students ticket (most universities have that), even when I eventually stopped using. I'm in the "make public transportation free" camp, and think this is a good step in that direction; even if we end up with "affordable for all" instead of "free". But as I said, that's opinion, not knowledge.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#103

Post by aloe_falsa »

Escapado wrote: post #75

I would argue making it free and keeping it free would have been a cool move. - Less/no expensive accounting - Less/no personnel for checking tickets - Less/no personnel for prosecuting people who don't have tickets - Less/no ticket vending machines (and all the maintenance that comes with it) - Less traffic on the roads since you can't beat "free" and hence less emissions (at least in hamburg trains operate on green…

At least in Berlin, they tried to introduce a free ticket. It failed due to organizational reasons: https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/open-mind/scheitert-jetzt-au...

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#104

Post by Freak_NL »

chrisseaton wrote: post #47
mahesh_rm wrote: post #11

I can't seem to find information on whether it is possible to purchase the ticket as a non German citizen.

> I can't seem to find information on whether it is possible to purchase the ticket as a non German citizen. Biggest hurdle will be getting a Germany ticket machine to accept a regular credit card! But otherwise, isn't discriminating based on nationality for good and services illegal?

Credit cards aren't regular in Europe. They accept Maestro debit cards though, which almost everyone has, and cash.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#105

Post by Hendrikto »

april_22 wrote: post #86

The German government did that to compensate for rising gasoline prices. While I think that is in general appreciated by the public, I am not quite sure how many people aged 45 above will use this ticket. They trains will be super crowded this summer and people will just prefer to use their car instead.

Also it is completely useless for people living on the countryside. The nearest train station is a 20 minute drive away from where I live, so this does nothing for me.

Still better than nothing, I guess.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#106

Post by jacobr1 »

Escapado wrote: post #75

I would argue making it free and keeping it free would have been a cool move. - Less/no expensive accounting - Less/no personnel for checking tickets - Less/no personnel for prosecuting people who don't have tickets - Less/no ticket vending machines (and all the maintenance that comes with it) - Less traffic on the roads since you can't beat "free" and hence less emissions (at least in hamburg trains operate on green…

> I have no idea if that would work for inter-city transport

With inner-city transport, while free would undoubtedly have some marginal impact (and more over time as residential and commute patterns shift) there probably wouldn't be large shifts in use.

I suspect for inter-city, you would actually see significantly increased usage, which could outweigh all the benefits cited.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#107

Post by k8sToGo »

kuschku wrote: post #76
alecco wrote: post #19

Populism. This will make the country consume more energy. There's a crisis and the solution is saving as much energy as possible. And help companies not go bankrupt. But that doesn't sell...

It’ll move energy use from highly inefficient personal vehicles burning gasoline to highly efficient trains using mostly renewable electricity, during the summer where more than enough electricity is available.

Still plenty of diesel run train engines in Germany.

Also coal is still being burnt. So I don't think it is mostly renewable.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#108

Post by soco »

mbg721 wrote: post #92
butterlesstoast wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For all the Americans. Converting from euros to USD and liters to gallons, gas is roughly $12 a gallon at this moment.

Out of curiosity, for people who live in small towns/villages in Germany, how much driving is expected on a typical day? Most Americans commute about half an hour, twice a day, right?

Not German, I live in a Swiss village and drive zero km a day. But I spend almost an hour/leg in public transport traveling door-to-door to the office when I go there (well, before covid much more often). I can also work in the train most of the time - 45 minutes of said hour - so that it counts as work time too. So, no reason to drive at all. I only take the car at weekends for doing shopping or doing some visits, even then not always.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#109

Post by chrisseaton »

Freak_NL wrote: post #104
chrisseaton wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't seem to find information on whether it is possible to purchase the ticket as a non German citizen. Biggest hurdle will be getting a Germany ticket machine to accept a regular credit card! But otherwise, isn't discriminating based on nationality for good and services illegal?

Credit cards aren't regular in Europe. They accept Maestro debit cards though, which almost everyone has, and cash.

> Credit cards aren't regular in Europe.

Pretty sure it's just Germany being pig-headed about it for some reason. Everywhere else in Europe is perfectly happy to accept a credit card. I do 99.999% of all my spending on a credit card, like most millennial people or younger, and the only people in the developed world who this is a problem for is the Germans.

Re: 9-Euro-Ticket

#110

Post by dx034 »

WA wrote: post #7
qwertox wrote: post #2

I think it's great, but honestly, placing it at 15€ would have made only a little difference to the consumer, who is already getting a lot for the value, and helped the railway operators a good deal. As a compromise the age of kids who can travel together with their parents for free could have been raised from 6 to 8 years.

Exactly the opposite. It should've been 0€, because then you: * don't have to sell tickets at all * don't have to check tickets in trains and reduce costs The overhead of selling tickets with the new price points might actually eat up all what's left of profits.

Ticket checks are incredibly rare in most cities already, Germans tend to buy tickets because it's illegal not to, not because it's more economical given the fine you pay without one.

And selling tickets will be an extremely minor overhead, probably <5% including re-programming machines.

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