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A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

theatlantic.com

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Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#211

Post by treis »

jayski wrote: post #24

Im 99% sure the wife in this story used the glass as an excuse to get out. If youre happy with the life youve built together and love your partner theres no way you leave it over something like this. I dont buy the "it shows disrespect" argument. Shes going to be with somebody else in a years time. But when youre in a bad situation and the other person isn't giving you a good reason to leave sometimes you have to get…

Projecting a lot, I feel like this guy is just a narcissist. Kind of making it all about him but in a way that doesn't portray him in a truly negative light. Also, guessing his ex-wife probably doesn't want a book about her divorce to be part of the national chatter.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#212

Post by [deleted] »

DanHulton wrote: post #22

There is a whole other potential article out there that could be written from the ex-wife's side - "My marriage died because I couldn't make this one simple sacrifice". And I suspect both would just as incorrect, at least by omission. The glass thing is a useful article hook, but it's unlikely that it encompasses the sole reason their marriage fell apart. There is a deeper issue here, about neither side being willing…

[deleted]

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#213

Post by powerslacker »

giantg2 wrote: post #83
snarf21 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Divorced and looking back, the root cause of this (in my experience) is a lack of empathy. Love is easy to come by while empathy requires walking in someone else's shoes. I understand this Same Fight because I lived through that. It is never about that thing, it is about not being seen. As the author is processing his divorce, it is good he sees that there is value in doing something selflessly. However, I can't help…

"Force the other person to plan weeks of meals, keep the pantry stocked, etc. shines a bigger light on the unseen work and value each partner is providing." If my wife were doing this, our grocery bill would double and it would all be frozen dinners and takeout. I'm not sure I trust her to do safety critical mechanic work either. So maybe switching isn't great for some tasks. Edit: It seems people disagree. Why? All…

Funnily enough, randoms on the internet seem to think they know your wife better than you do.

I agree with your position, not everyone is suited for every task. In my house, there are certain chores that only I do because I'm the only one capable. On the other hand, there are certain chores my wife won't let me near because I'll make an absolute mess of things.

I think a good number of people on this site have swallowed a tad too much equality propaganda. Individuals are not all the same and they don't all have the same capabilities, instead individuals complement each other with their diverse skills, views, personalities, and natural talents.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#214

Post by 4ec0755f5522 »

DanHulton wrote: post #22

There is a whole other potential article out there that could be written from the ex-wife's side - "My marriage died because I couldn't make this one simple sacrifice". And I suspect both would just as incorrect, at least by omission. The glass thing is a useful article hook, but it's unlikely that it encompasses the sole reason their marriage fell apart. There is a deeper issue here, about neither side being willing…

The wife's article would be called "I told him everything I needed but he still thinks it's about the dishes".

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#215

Post by metadat »

300bps wrote: post #123
toomuchtodo wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't recommend this book enough on the topic. TLDR Women are more picky then Men in the courtship marketplace, and finding a partner with matching values is most important to growing and staying together. People expect a fairy tale, when they're signing up for a job (relationships require work and effort). A quote from the author 10 years post publishing: “I think the book is really, ironically, about having highe…

I first want to say that I cringed reading the entire original article. But I want to address something you said as well, "TLDR Women are more picky th a n Men". This is highly age-dependent... On average : A 21 year old woman on a dating site has to be picky. She's getting constant messages from men anywhere from 18 years old to 100 years old. A 40 year old woman is still a bit picky on a dating site but is starting…

This is an over generalization, every person is different and has their own quirks and preferences.

The hot take you've presented is useless at best, and possibly even harmful to view people from such a single dimensional lens based on their age.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#216

Post by bee_rider »

giantg2 wrote: post #156
bee_rider wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She would probably also outsource that mechanical work to a mechanic, just like you'd outsource the cooking work to the microwave/freezing company. Although, by outsourcing this work, you'd both have a little bit more free time. It might be a worthwhile experiment just to try for a month, if you can swing it.

You don't understand, I already do the shopping/cooking and the mechanic work. Outsourcing costs a lot of money. Plus, if the point of switching is to appreciate the labor of the other person, then outsourcing defeats the purpose. My point is, some tasks may not be equally suited for both people in the relationship.

Ah, ok. I thought you were providing one example where she normally does a task that you'd do poorly, and one where you normally do a task that she'd do did poorly, to set up a sort of symmetrical example.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#217

Post by em-bee »

bena wrote: post #113
erikstarck wrote: post #73

If you haven't read "The Five Love Languages" yet and are in a relationship, then I highly suggest you do. It might save it before it's too late. And just to make this slightly more startup-related as well: as team members, we also have "love languages", ways we communicate respect and appreciation to each other. Sometimes we speak different languages and don't understand each other. That breaks the team.

I'd recommend people don't. Mostly because people read stuff like that and extrospect rather than introspect. "How can I get my partner to speak my love language?" rather than "What is my partner's love language?" Everything becomes another tool of manipulation. "My love language is 'acts of service', so if you don't take out the trash, you don't love me." That's just straight up emotional manipulation. Whereas it sh…

if someone is using love as a tool for emotional manipulation they will be doing that already before they read the book. at best the book helps them to come up with that phrase. but not reading it won't prevent them from doing it.

on the contrary, if you both read the book together then you will both become aware that this is happening and you can do something about it.

There should be a rule, where you can learn about this and other concepts, but you are never allowed to talk about it with people you have a relationship with.

that sounds just about like the worst idea i have read in this whole thread today. it is exactly the not talking about these concepts that will enable the manipulation that you fear. to avoid manipulation you need to have this knowledge out in the open.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#218

Post by dang »

greenonions wrote: post #105
hackeraccount wrote: post #35

Marriage is like kids. What does it expect? Blood. I remember a guy who planned to join the Marines when I was a kid. Every time I saw him he was doing push-ups. All the time. A neighbor - who was ex-military or maybe even a Marine himself - told me that was all well and good but had limited utility. If you go can do 100 push-ups when you go through boot camp they'll make you do 110. They want blood.

Quoted post unavailable.

Please omit hostile swipes from your HN comments, even when another comment doesn't make sense or feels off somehow. The swipe aspect only makes everything worse. You can express your question in a more open-minded way.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#219

Post by metadat »

giantg2 wrote: post #100
didgeoridoo wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. I am on the other side of this in my marriage — my wife leaves her water glass out (sometimes for days) because she “might want to use it again”. It bothered me, so I put it in the dishwasher. She didn’t like that, so I stopped doing it. And I got over the fact that there are sometimes six or seven half-full glasses around the house at any time, because I am not a petty psychotic who would take something so…

My wife put some water in the microwave for tea and left the room. When it was done, I put the tea ball in it and set the timer for her. Thinking that she would be back in the room in a few minutes and the timer would let her know it was ready. Instead of thank you for starting her tea, I was told I was "too controlling". Ok... I guess I won't do nice random things like start your tea from now on.

I'm not going to give you specific advice, as that would be controlling (tongue in cheek / bad joke, sorry), and you also haven't specifically requested any. However I do feel compelled to share some of my own experience.

In my last LT relationship, I was accused being controlling and the relationship was totally, impossibly screwed. This is a very serious accusation, and they were interpreting attempts to be genuinely nice as "controlling". I am actually pretty flexible and easy going, but no matter what I did or changed, there was always some other new way in which I was "being emotionally abusive".

I'm now in a new relationship, and a few times I've pre-emptively apologized to my partner about similar actions, because I was concerned about them being interpreted as controlling. I was floored when she responded with indifference, saying she always appreciates my efforts and that I don't need to worry.

Having a partner who "gets you" and appreciates what you try to do for them has been earth shatteringly beautiful in my life. Empathy unlocks the best parts of life and the human experience. I know I'm extremely fortunate to have eventually gotten to where I am, and couldn't be happier with her. Soon I should probably ask if she'll marry me, advice on this would be welcome :) we are 9 months in, see each other every day and never fight, it's always collaborative.

Anyhow, the conclusion is:

It's always a good idea to ask many questions if you're being told you are wrong a lot, in any relationship (private life as well as work life). Sometimes the real issue may turn out to have nothing to do with you, after all.

Re: A dirty dish by the sink can be a big marriage problem

#220

Post by motohagiography »

So strange to read this as marriage hasn't really registered as thing for me in several years. I'm not sure what the case for it today is. Reading about guys saying if only they had been less of themselves, they might have avoided getting left just leaves me with a bad taste. I'm of the mind that we should take responsibility for our own happiness, and explicitly give others the opportunity to do the same for themselves.

Controversially, if there is one thing I have found people live to regret most it's apologizing. It has taken a while to articulate, but I think apologies are a broken concept because they are what we offer transactionally when we are at a disadvantage, they're an unsatisfying, forced declaration of kind of moral bankruptcy and submission, which is the exact opposite of what someone who loves you wishes for you, or wants from you.

I consider that what I really mean is, "I took this specific thing for granted and what I mean is I don't take it for granted, and thank you for it." Acknowledging and thanking someone for what you recieved from them adds value to a relationship, whereas an apology just asks to write it off. The same may be true for promises as apologies are mainly an artifact of breaking them. Taking responsibility for our own happiness and converting apologies into recognition and thanks before uttering them seems a lot more sustainable and likeable than being introspective and trying to change and compromise. Maybe I'm out of touch, but something about the article rubbed me the wrong way.

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