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Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

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Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#91

Post by lurch_mojoff »

Greg12x wrote: post #28
bluekeybox wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, reads like something a psychopath would write. Reminds me of Cat's diary entry: http://www.goodeatsfanpage.com/humor/otherhumor/dog_cat_diar...

Wow. How really? He was writing his opinion. Is that considered psychopath?

Lack of empathy is the definition of psychopathy. A psychopath will look at someone ran over on the street and think "too bad it ruined that nice jacket" or something similarly disjointed form the fact that a human being is dead. Stallman's comment is similarly unempathetic.

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#92

Post by richcollins »

marshray wrote: post #53

Oh come on, grow a spine people. Quit whining about 'insensitive'. Just because you die doesn't give you a free pass from criticism for more than about 24 hours, and most people don't even get that much. Stallman is right. Computer-as-a-jail is Jobs' legacy and I too hope it dies with him. vvv Edit vvv Look at it this way: Jobs and Apple did truly amazing things in the usability department. For that they should be ri…

His claim is that the negatives outweigh the positives and that its a good thing that Steve Jobs no longer actively influences computing. I can't disagree with this sentiment more. Making technology that people can actually use is far better than making unusable technology that is open.

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#93

Post by Nutella2 »

mvitti wrote: post #65

I wonder if this guy thinks there is ANY software that is worthy of being purchased or is it all tainted in some way? Has he ever purchased a can of soda, a movie ticket, a laptop computer, etc.? How does he even subsist in our corporate consumerist society without compromising his highly developed sense of right and wrong? I don't know but gathering from his hateful disposition it must not be easy.

What Stallman's for is free as in 'free speech'. Free as in 'free beer' is something completely different.

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#94

Post by marshray »

richcollins wrote: post #92
marshray wrote: post #53

Oh come on, grow a spine people. Quit whining about 'insensitive'. Just because you die doesn't give you a free pass from criticism for more than about 24 hours, and most people don't even get that much. Stallman is right. Computer-as-a-jail is Jobs' legacy and I too hope it dies with him. vvv Edit vvv Look at it this way: Jobs and Apple did truly amazing things in the usability department. For that they should be ri…

His claim is that the negatives outweigh the positives and that its a good thing that Steve Jobs no longer actively influences computing. I can't disagree with this sentiment more. Making technology that people can actually use is far better than making unusable technology that is open.

But it's a false dichotomy. There's nothing inherent about usability that requires jailed computing.

I submit two examples:

1. The Apple Mac was unquestioningly a pioneer in computer usability. Yet it didn't need a kernel that refused to run apps that weren't "approved" with a cryptographic signature from some central authority. (Yes the original Mac case was closed but there was a high voltage monitor in there and it had no upgrade plan anyway. Most later models were expandable.)

2. I have Google Nexus S running Android that's every bit as usable, even for nontechnical folks, as an iPhone. It's not carrier locked and the OS is predominantly open-source, much of it even GPL. It doesn't need rooting or jailbreaking because there's no jail to break. And guess what: there are way more people "actually using" Android phones than the jailed ones from Apple. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Smartphone_share_current.p...

Jobs was good at many things: leading Apple, leading product development, advancing quality and usability, making products people want to buy, making great profit margins. He was an incredible guy.

But just because the same person and company also embraced jailed computing doesn't mean that it's somehow a necessary condition for usability, any more than the dictator is a necessary condition for the trains to run on time.

In fact, I think the evidence points to the contrary and it would be a shame for this confusion to send computing on a step backwards in one direction or another.

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#95

Post by burgerbrain »

deanproxy wrote: post #90
burgerbrain wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should people be stifled just because somebody died? What exactly are we concerned about? Steve Jobs becoming disgruntled, rising from his grave, and sucking the blood of virgins during the night? This "dead people are off limits" thing is a relic from the superstitious dark ages. If we can praise the actions of dead people, we can criticize them too.

He has a family that he left behind. His wife and children. If your father just passed away 48 hours ago, would you want to read about how somebody is glad that he's finally gone? I sure wouldn't... It's called respect.

I somehow suspect that they aren't reading RMS's blog right now...

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#97

Post by pork »

OpieCunningham wrote: post #83
pasbesoin wrote: post #43

You know, I have some feeling surrounding Jobs' passing (while I never met him, I've known a number of people who did -- mostly from 20+ years ago), and I've appreciated the tributes. But there is also the desire and need to discuss it in context. Some respect may well be warranted, and there may not be the need to rush headlong into critical analysis, but Jobs' passing does promote a lot of attention and focus that…

Well said. I generally don't agree with Stallman's viewpoint, but his voice is important. I would neither like to see an all encompassing Jobs-world nor a Stallman-world. As long as the one exists with the other we all have more opportunity. The Jobs approach enables mass consumption of technology. The Stallman approach enables fully detailed exploration of technology. Either, on their own, severely restricts access…

Ironically, Jobs would be perfectly acceptable in Stallman's world -- he (Jobs) took free software and did what he wanted with it, exercising his right to tinker (and profit).

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#98

Post by pork »

_delirium wrote: post #89
Toady wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Equating the iPhone to a "jail" is goofy political hyperbole. Normal people don't even view software in that context. It's just a piece of hardware and software they choose to use or not use. Stallman represents the strain of computer nerds who want to view their hobby as the bold movement of a freedom fighter. They are out-of-touch and don't understand what normal people think and feel. They want their nerd playgrou…

It's hard for me to say how representative my non-techie friends are, but nearly all have some understanding that the App Store is tightly controlled by Apple, and not always in ways they agree with (apps being banned or not approved makes mainstream news semi-regularly). They accept it because they still like the iPhone more than the alternatives, but I wouldn't say that they are 100% happy with the way the App Stor…

I would say that the very fact that they join "tell apple to unban..." groups makes them non-representative.

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#99

Post by pork »

akuzi wrote: post #22

It's worth remembering that even Stallman himself admits he is mildly autistic. Autism is often characterized by black and white thinking and lack of empathy towards others - both of which are displayed to excess in his comment.

This is fascinating and very relevant -- do you have a source?

Re: Richard Stallman on Steve Jobs

#100

Post by SkyMarshal »

brlewis wrote: post #84
pasbesoin wrote: post #43

You know, I have some feeling surrounding Jobs' passing (while I never met him, I've known a number of people who did -- mostly from 20+ years ago), and I've appreciated the tributes. But there is also the desire and need to discuss it in context. Some respect may well be warranted, and there may not be the need to rush headlong into critical analysis, but Jobs' passing does promote a lot of attention and focus that…

...I would expect the stories and comments to move to a full and varied spectrum of views....there needs to be room for a larger conversation. You said this well, but it's been said better: "Here's to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently. They're not fond of rules, and they have no respect for the status quo. You can quote…

I find myself wondering which one you're referring to with that quote - Jobs or Stallman. That's probably a good thing.
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